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The New Fokker 50 Thread

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The New Fokker 50 Thread

Postby FokkerCharlie » Mon Nov 12, 2007 2:32 pm

Hello, again!

OK- this is a new thread that I have set up to deal with the work that I am undertaking (with, of course, plenty of input and contributions from FG community members) on the Fokker 50 cockpit. A previous thread is http://www.flightgear.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=345. I wanted this new thread to reflect the progress that we have made on the aircraft, and also for it to have 'Fokker 50' in the title!

For those of you unfamiliar with the project so far-
- The external model, by Erik Hofman, is excellent, and can be downloaded from the aircraft page. It also includes a working FDM.
- Making the internal aspects of the F50 is more or less my first FGFS or 3d-modelling experience.
- For a living, I fly the F50. The only programming experience I have is in the distant past, and limited.

Here's a picture of the latest progress:

Image

Things are coming along, and a state of flyability approaches. I need some help, however:

I am now at the stage where I'd like to be able to interact with the cockpit. For instance, I'd like to be able to swap standby/active frequencies in my new NAV receiver, press buttons, make things light-up when I press them, that sort of thing.

AJM was good enough to write a wiki page on creating a simple Nasal script, which was most helpful. However, it's not clear to me how I can make a mouse-click translate to an event in the aircraft. I've also been looking at other models to see if I could figure it out. However, I can't.

So, could someone give me a hand figuring out chunks, layers, actions etc? Is there an online resource that I can refer to? AJM, do you have time for another of your excellent tutorials?!

Happy flying!
Charlie
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Postby Gijs » Mon Nov 12, 2007 3:41 pm

Hi Charlie,

the picture is looking really really good! You can really see it's a cockpit now! I'm really (sorry for my hundert of reallys ;)) exciting to fly with it. Is there already a test-version available (for the stable version of FG)?

Sorry, but my "old" computer had a crash so I lost my instruments :( I don't think you really need them, because a lot of them already are implented i see in the picture. But tell me if not. I'm a bit busy now, but if you have some (small) things (like a seat) or so i would love to model it.

Cheers,
Gijs
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Postby ajm » Tue Nov 13, 2007 9:33 am

Hi Charlie, great to see your progress. Unfortunately I'm really busy with work just now and it'll probably be a while before I can get a chance to write another tutorial :-\

Having said that, I (and others of course!) can hopefully give advice here which might be enough to get you going.

Your main sticking point now is probably adding clickable hotspots. The bad news is that with plib based flightgear, like 0.9.10 and 0.9.11 when it arrives, hotspots are a truly horrible chore. I decided earlier this year that I'd never touch them again, now that we have a far superior alternative...

...Which is the good news. With an OSG based FG (such as our main CVS branch), we have the truly superb "pick animation". This makes creating clickable objects really very easy indeed; the only downsides being that (1) you need to get an OSG based FG running and (2) people running 0.9.10 and 0.9.11 won't be able to use the clickable parts of your cockpit.

So, the first step is to decide which method you're going to use. The first one is your only choice if you want to stick with current FG releases (and it's not impossible to make work, only tiresome!)

For a reasonably clear example of the "old" hotspots, have a look at something like the Spitfire (Spitfire/Models/panel-hotspots.xml). The <action> sections are the clickable hotspots - you can see that they're given a position on the grid with x&y , and a size with w& h. Most of the "commands" you will need are pretty straightforward, but these are documented at Docs/README.commands . Just don't copy the "leading slashes" that you'll find in property names in the Spit - these days we're at the stage of having multiple pilots per aircraft on MP, and my earlier warnings are about these slashes are more valid than ever :-)

You need to include this "panel" of hotspots in your model.xml just like another instrument.

Does any of that make sense?

Cheers,

AJ
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Postby FokkerCharlie » Tue Nov 13, 2007 4:56 pm

Hi AJ

Thanks for the input- it sounds like going with the most up-to-date option would be smartest, so I'm busy trying to install CVS etc.

Gijs- I'll release a flying model in the fullness of time!

Cheerio

Charlie
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Postby Gijs » Tue Nov 13, 2007 8:47 pm

Sorry :oops: , but what is fullnes?
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Postby FokkerCharlie » Tue Nov 13, 2007 9:31 pm

Sorry, Gijs

'in the fullness of time' is an English expression, meaning it will happen when it's ready- and it ain't ready yet!

Cheerio!
Charlie
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Postby ajm » Tue Nov 13, 2007 10:51 pm

FokkerCharlie wrote:Thanks for the input- it sounds like going with the most up-to-date option would be smartest, so I'm busy trying to install CVS etc.


A brave man indeed :-) Getting FG CVS working on windows is maybe a little bit more awkward than on *nix, but quite a few people have done it so you should be able to get there in the end.

The best place for help on that will almost certainly be the IRC channel which is well worth dropping in to. There are a few Windows users on there who are running FG CVS and even those of us who aren't might be able to help with some questions.

The IRC channel is #flightgear on irc.flightgear.org. Normally busiest during our (UK) evenings.

Cheers,

AJ
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Postby Gijs » Fri Nov 16, 2007 6:13 pm

FokkerCharlie wrote:'in the fullness of time' is an English expression, meaning it will happen when it's ready- and it ain't ready yet!
Ok, than we just have to wait. Is there anything I can do for you and the cockpit?
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Postby Kcid » Wed Dec 12, 2007 10:59 am

AJM,

Is there already some documentation on clickable objects in the OSG based Flightgear?
If so, I can build them for you next week if you like FokkerCharlie.

Regards,
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Postby ajm » Wed Dec 12, 2007 4:13 pm

Yes, the OSG hotspots are created with a "pick animation". The documentation for that is in the model-howto.html in your Docs directory.

You can also have a look at the existing examples in the Bocian, Bucc, Lightning and many others.

They really are very straightforward, a delight to work with in comparison to the "old" hotspots :-)

Cheers,

AJ
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Postby FokkerCharlie » Mon Jan 21, 2008 6:02 pm

Hi Kcid

Sorry for the delayed response- I used to get email updates when there was a message here, but that seems to have disappeared. If you're still interested, it would be great if you'd have a look at this.

My cockpit is (still) very much a work-in-progress, but there are a few things to do in this respect, eg landing gear lever and VOR box controls.

If you like, I will upload the aircraft that I have so far, you can have a look, see what you'd like to do, and take it from there.

I've just (this hour) managed to get ver 1.0.0 working on my computer, so now I'm all set for some more modeling.

Cheers!
Charlie
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Postby Gijs » Mon Jan 21, 2008 6:04 pm

Hey,

You're back :)
I would love to see the plane!!
Maybey I can model something if you need it.

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Postby Kcid » Mon Jan 21, 2008 6:28 pm

Hi FokkerCharlie,

What instruments would you like to see modelled first?
If you name about 10 or so with maybe some pictures then I'll model them.
If you upload the cockpit I'll model them in and upload the result.

Regards,

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Postby FokkerCharlie » Mon Jan 21, 2008 9:22 pm

Dick, Gijs

Good to hear of your continued interest. Here's where we are:

Here is a link to the Fokker 50 package as it stands. It includes my work so far on the cockpit, as well as Erik's original external model. Delete the Fokker 50 folder in your FG data, and replace it with this. Enjoy, have a play, I hope that seeing this partially-completed work inspires you!

Here are some photos:

http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/charlesnet/fokker50/picturestodo.rar

They are intended for guidance in making models, as well as available for use as textures etc. They were all taken by me, so no problems with copyright etc.

http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/charlesnet/f ... kker50.rar

In the archive, there's a spreadsheet with, amongst other things, dimensions of the instruments, and data about how to place them. I don't know if there's somewhere we can have a shared upload, so for the moment if you wish to change / add something, it might be easiest to send it to me, I will incorporate it and re-upload. If you have a cleverer idea, let me know.

When you're ready, here's a list of a few things that are still in the 'to do' pile:

Instruments:
Central Alerting Panel (located just to the left of the engine insts)
Navigation display (EFIS screen no 2)
RMI switches (toggle pointer displays between ADF and VOR)
VSI
On the glareshield panel:
EFIS control panel
Flight mode panel (controls flight director, HSI course bars, heading bug etc)
ADF and COM boxes (if you do this, you may like to use my VOR box as a start?)
Transponder/TCAS
Nosewheel steering tiller- there's one on each side. Let's not worry to much about the microphone and the cup-holder, even though it's very useful!

Other stuff:
Texturing for the power-lever quadrant.
Animation for landing-gear handle, which seems to have broken since ver 1.0.0. Also the UP/DOWN lights. I am miles away from being able to make those work.
Beautifying the place in general. Sorry, but I'm a technical rather than artistic type, which you will see!

There's plenty more, but this will do for starters.

If there is a particular item you'd like to work on, then please go ahead. I suggest that you post what you're doing here to avoid us duplicating each other's work. I will also be happy to provide full explanations of how things work in the aircraft as and when you get to that stage.

Hooray!
Charlie
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Postby Gijs » Tue Jan 22, 2008 7:38 am

Sorry, but I was unable to open the .ODS file with measurements. Could you please place it in a format Excel can opens?

Gijs
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