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Change runway designators

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Change runway designators

Postby dom_vc10 » Fri Sep 10, 2021 10:45 am

Hi

using Navigraph airacs has an issue when the FG scenery data is so old. I see that if the runway designation has changed from 09 to 10 then the procedures do not show in the route planner. If I am correct I need to edit the ils and threshold xml files. Is there anything else or these two should be sufficient. ( I can see this could be a long job lol )
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Re: Change runway designators

Postby Ovazor » Fri Sep 10, 2021 11:10 am

I think that the you need to change the apt.dat file as well.
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Re: Change runway designators

Postby merspieler » Fri Sep 10, 2021 12:28 pm

That's a known issue... maybe that could be solved with some script foo... but so far I haven't seen a solution other than manually editing files.

If you can get the the info of where in the navdata the needed information are and where in the fg scenery it needs to be changed, I might be able to create a script.

If you want a good test case for this: YBBN, it got one rwy decomissioned and one new build.
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Re: Change runway designators

Postby legoboyvdlp » Fri Sep 10, 2021 12:31 pm

No need to do any of that - it's already fixed for months already (since May). On FlightGear 2020.4 you can simply add a runway_rename.xml file. That allows you to remap the runway numbering. File format:

EIDW.runway_rename.xml
Code: Select all
<?xml version='1.0' encoding='ISO-8859-1'?>
<PropertyList>
   <runway-rename>
      <runway>
         <old-ident>10</old-ident>
         <new-ident>10R</new-ident>
      </runway>
      <runway>
         <old-ident>28</old-ident>
         <new-ident>28L</new-ident>
      </runway>
   </runway-rename>
</PropertyList>
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Re: Change runway designators

Postby dom_vc10 » Fri Sep 10, 2021 12:37 pm

ok, that's cool.

It's one file per airport or more can be added in the xml, I don't see any identifier for the airport itself in that (edit I overlooked that in the post). Still a script may be useful so we can make large updates possibly? This new xml could make it a lot easier. Just need to find a way to get the two sources together so we have a list of old and new then export that into the xml.
Last edited by dom_vc10 on Fri Sep 10, 2021 2:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Change runway designators

Postby portreekid » Fri Sep 10, 2021 1:47 pm

legoboyvdlp wrote in Fri Sep 10, 2021 12:31 pm:No need to do any of that - it's already fixed for months already (since May). On FlightGear 2020.4 you can simply add a runway_rename.xml file. That allows you to remap the runway numbering. File format:

EIDW.runway_rename.xml


This sounds like something that could go through Terrasync!?
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Re: Change runway designators

Postby merspieler » Fri Sep 10, 2021 2:04 pm

Thanks, lego...

dom_vc10: if you get me the sources of the to compare files (probably apt.dat and ICAO-something.xml) I can write a script... But honestly I'd rather update the apt.dat... even if there are some mismatches right now... this should all work well once ws3 with runtime generated airports works...


Putting it into terrasync is a bad idea... different ppl have different data... you'd screw stuff up big time...
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Re: Change runway designators

Postby V12 » Fri Sep 10, 2021 2:38 pm

Thx lego. It is very usefull info.
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Re: Change runway designators

Postby legoboyvdlp » Fri Sep 10, 2021 2:44 pm

portreekid wrote in Fri Sep 10, 2021 1:47 pm:
This sounds like something that could go through Terrasync!?


Yes, that's the intention. Just haven't gotten around to arranging for these files to be accepted at the online portal yet.

Putting it into terrasync is a bad idea... different ppl have different data... you'd screw stuff up big time...


As far as I know it should not be a problem, because the Level-D parser will search first for the standard runway number, and then search for an override file if it doesn't find the standard runway number.

But honestly I'd rather update the apt.dat... even if there are some mismatches right now... this should all work well once ws3 with runtime generated airports works...


I don't agree with modifying the apt.dat file in FGData -- in general, modifying things in /data/ folder are to be avoided as a best practice. Any changes should be done either through the Scenery/NavData/apt/ mechanism for small patches, or else the entire file should be replaced by new X-Plane data from the Gateway. That would likely also involves updating navaid positions and 3D models.
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Re: Change runway designators

Postby merspieler » Fri Sep 10, 2021 3:03 pm

There's already a new apt.dat file for ws3 in the fgdata next branch ;-)
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Re: Change runway designators

Postby BecOzIcan » Sat Sep 11, 2021 2:17 am

legoboyvdlp wrote in Fri Sep 10, 2021 12:31 pm:No need to do any of that - it's already fixed for months already (since May). On FlightGear 2020.4 you can simply add a runway_rename.xml file. That allows you to remap the runway numbering. File format:

EIDW.runway_rename.xml


Thanks for the tip Lego

Where would such a file live ? (no thread found)

With the Airport overrides (thresholds, ILS, runway usage and groundnet) ie in /My Sceneries/Airports/I/C/A/O ...
or
With the APT.DAT overrides ie /My Sceneries/NavData


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Re: Change runway designators

Postby portreekid » Sat Sep 11, 2021 6:40 am

merspieler wrote in Fri Sep 10, 2021 2:04 pm:Thanks, lego...
Putting it into terrasync is a bad idea... different ppl have different data... you'd screw stuff up big time...


I'm aware of the problems, see the case of EGEL. apt.dat -> EGEL [H] Eddystone Lighthouse. There is a groundnet for the real EGEL, it had to be removed from the LOG traffic. This is corrected in ws03, but we still can't correct terrasync, as "people will have different data"
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Re: Change runway designators

Postby legoboyvdlp » Sat Sep 11, 2021 11:13 am

BecOzIcan wrote in Sat Sep 11, 2021 2:17 am:With the Airport overrides (thresholds, ILS, runway usage and groundnet) ie in /My Sceneries/Airports/I/C/A/O ...
or
With the APT.DAT overrides ie /My Sceneries/NavData


They go in the /Airports/I/C/A directory. I'll see if I can't get an example into TerraSync at some point in the near future if that helps!
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Re: Change runway designators

Postby BecOzIcan » Sat Sep 11, 2021 12:58 pm

legoboyvdlp wrote in Sat Sep 11, 2021 11:13 am:
They go in the /Airports/I/C/A directory. I'll see if I can't get an example into TerraSync at some point in the near future if that helps!


Thanks for the confirmation and don't worry about putting it to TS; I ll give it a go on my machine;

I am quite keen to test how this override would affect AI traffic which uses the other files in the folder (thresholds, ILS and RWYUSE) as they all reference runway numbers.

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Re: Change runway designators

Postby dom_vc10 » Mon Sep 13, 2021 11:10 am

merspieler wrote in Fri Sep 10, 2021 2:04 pm:Thanks, lego...

dom_vc10: if you get me the sources of the to compare files (probably apt.dat and ICAO-something.xml) I can write a script... But honestly I'd rather update the apt.dat... even if there are some mismatches right now... this should all work well once ws3 with runtime generated airports works...
.


I will take a look into it this evening.
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