Board index FlightGear Support Flying

Disabling Flight Director  Topic is solved

Controlling your aircraft, using the autopilot etc.

Disabling Flight Director

Postby tfreriks » Sat Apr 13, 2019 1:13 pm

Especially in the Citation II, the Flight Director checkbox comes on automatically and I can't turn it off until I get above 1500'. Then, again, it engages when I get below maybe 500'. Both conditions really screw up my flight plan. Can I disconnect the Flight Director, or stop it from engaging by default? Route Manager works fine without FD.
tfreriks
 
Posts: 84
Joined: Mon Dec 31, 2018 9:52 pm

Re: Disabling Flight Director

Postby Octal450 » Sat Apr 13, 2019 9:35 pm

That makes no sense, a flight director is just a set of bars which would guide you along the A/P commands. It has nothing to do with the route manager or flight plan.

Kind Regards,
Josh
Waste of time. Goodbye forever.
Octal450
 
Posts: 4398
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2015 12:51 pm

Re: Disabling Flight Director

Postby tfreriks » Sun Apr 14, 2019 4:42 pm

The AP is fine above 1500', but with the Citation II, the FlightDirector box is checked and I can't uncheck it. I set up on a heading or the RM GPS course and a climb in the AP, but when I uncheck the FD, the flight goes whacky. On approach, I have APP engaged (HSI and GS) but at about 1000' or so the FD box re-engages and wants to do whatever it wants, which is usually plow into the buildings. In all the other planes, I can disengage it before takeoff.
tfreriks
 
Posts: 84
Joined: Mon Dec 31, 2018 9:52 pm

Re: Disabling Flight Director

Postby Octal450 » Sun Apr 14, 2019 6:10 pm

That sounds like a generic autopilot controller. :(
Is this the default FGAddon one? Perhaps I'll look and see if I can see the issue.

Josh
Waste of time. Goodbye forever.
Octal450
 
Posts: 4398
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2015 12:51 pm

Re: Disabling Flight Director

Postby tfreriks » Sun Apr 14, 2019 6:30 pm

I don't know what AP it is. I'd appreciate it. The Citation II is my favorite long-distance aircraft, and it's disconcerting to crash on final approach every time.
tfreriks
 
Posts: 84
Joined: Mon Dec 31, 2018 9:52 pm

Re: Disabling Flight Director

Postby WoodSTokk » Mon Apr 15, 2019 12:02 am

tfreriks wrote in Sun Apr 14, 2019 6:30 pm:I don't know what AP it is. I'd appreciate it. The Citation II is my favorite long-distance aircraft, and it's disconcerting to crash on final approach every time.

The AP on the Citation II can not land the aircraft, therefor it disengage it self below 500 AGL (radar altimeter).
This means, you must fly the short final and touch down manually.

PS: i see now what you mean. This checkbox is wrong wired up. The checkbox is checked if the FD is OFF (annunciator light on the panel) and vice versa.
Will try to turn arround it.
Thanks to point it out.
WoodSTokk
 
Posts: 342
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 2:30 pm
Location: Milky Way/Sol/Earth/Europe
Callsign: OE-WST
IRC name: WoodSTokk
Version: 2018.3.1
OS: Debian Buster/Sid

Re: Disabling Flight Director

Postby Octal450 » Mon Apr 15, 2019 1:21 pm

Are you sure the flight director trips off too? That is rather odd, on most planes with no auto land. A/P trips, but FD continues LOC and G/S guidance.

Josh
Waste of time. Goodbye forever.
Octal450
 
Posts: 4398
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2015 12:51 pm

Re: Disabling Flight Director

Postby WoodSTokk » Mon Apr 15, 2019 4:39 pm

it0uchpods wrote in Mon Apr 15, 2019 1:21 pm:Are you sure the flight director trips off too? That is rather odd, on most planes with no auto land. A/P trips, but FD continues LOC and G/S guidance.

Josh


I have only improved that aircraft, not build.
The FD activate/deactivate all modes off AP.
On the Citation II, the FD is linked with the AP. If you deactivate FD, it will also deactivate AP and vice versa.
The AP can bring you down to DH, but not land. So its unnecessary if the FD show you the right controls. Otherwise it can also land.

@ tfreriks
The AP will now disengage at DH set on radar altimeter (but dont set it to 0).
Pushed update to trunk.
Please check behavior.
WoodSTokk
 
Posts: 342
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 2:30 pm
Location: Milky Way/Sol/Earth/Europe
Callsign: OE-WST
IRC name: WoodSTokk
Version: 2018.3.1
OS: Debian Buster/Sid

Re: Disabling Flight Director

Postby Octal450 » Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:45 pm

Hi,
Not quite true, LOC and G/S guidance is not auto land guidance. There is no technical reason that it couldn't guide you, and obviously you deviate when close enough to flare and align yourself.

But yes FD killing AP sounds okay.

Kind Regards,
Josh
Waste of time. Goodbye forever.
Octal450
 
Posts: 4398
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2015 12:51 pm

Re: Disabling Flight Director

Postby tfreriks » Thu Apr 18, 2019 8:54 pm

I've been out of touch. Did you say you had an update for the Citation II FD problem?
tfreriks
 
Posts: 84
Joined: Mon Dec 31, 2018 9:52 pm

Re: Disabling Flight Director

Postby tfreriks » Thu Apr 18, 2019 9:09 pm

Assuming the checkbox is wired opposite and defaults to OFF (not ON) then the AP doesn't control heading or VS as long as it is OFF. When I switch it to unchecked (now ON) the plane goes nuts. I'm able to pull out of the drive and steep turn, but it shouldn't happen. Same with landing: when it becomes checked automatically (I assume it thinks it is turning itself off), the plane drives into the ground. Sometimes I can pull out in time and sometimes, well, sometimes it makes the nightly news.

Also, 25% of the time when I start, the warning lights are all off. Most of the time, however, L HYD/PRESS LO, R HYD/PRESS LO, L OIL/ PRESS LO, R OIL/PRESS LO, L GEN OFF, R GEN OFF, L FUEL PRESS LO, and R FUEL PRESS LO and all lit. THe GENs I can't even fix by flipping the switch.
tfreriks
 
Posts: 84
Joined: Mon Dec 31, 2018 9:52 pm

Re: Disabling Flight Director

Postby WoodSTokk » Thu Apr 18, 2019 10:25 pm

If the annunciator 'HYD PRESS LO', 'FUEL PRESS LO', 'OIL PRESS LO' and 'GEN OFF' is lit for a engine, this means that the engine is not running.
You should also see that on the engine instruments.

To manually start the engine:

* make sure that the 'FUEL BOOST' switch is in 'NORM' or 'ON' position
If you set the 'FUEL BOOST' switch to 'ON' position, the 'FUEL PRESS LO' annunciator goes off and the 'FUEL BOOST ON' annunciator will lit

* push the 'ENGINE START' button (button will lit as long the start procedure is running)

* at around 8-10% N2 (turbine), lift the CUTOUT lock and push the thrust lever to IDLE
The CUTOUT lock will spring down if the thrust lever is at or above IDLE to prevent you from pulling back the lever behind IDLE
If the 'FUEL BOOST' switch is in 'NORM' position, the GCU activate the 'FUEL BOOST ON' automatically at around 8-10% N2

The remaining procedure will be controlled by the GCU (Generator Control Unit).
While the engine spool up, the 'OIL PRESS LO' should extinguish first, later also the 'HYD PRESS LO'.
If the engine reaches a running condition and the 'FUEL BOOST' switch is in 'NORM' position, the GCU deactivate the fuel boost automatically.
Now, you can switch the generator to 'ON'.
WoodSTokk
 
Posts: 342
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 2:30 pm
Location: Milky Way/Sol/Earth/Europe
Callsign: OE-WST
IRC name: WoodSTokk
Version: 2018.3.1
OS: Debian Buster/Sid

Re: Disabling Flight Director

Postby tfreriks » Fri Apr 19, 2019 5:02 pm

I appreciate that advice. I also figured out that I shouldn't activate the RM until I'm at about 4000'AGL. Then I uncheck the FD checkbox to activate the AP. That works fine.

But I haven't found a way to keep the FD box un-checked as I'm landing. There's a wise adage in flying: "the number of landings should equal the number of takeoffs". That doesn't always work with the Citation II since it crashes when the FD box automatically checks again at low altitude. As I understand it, 'checked' actually means OFF and 'unchecked' actually means ON.

Also, I found that you have to completely close the FG program to get a new instance of the Citation II loaded, one in which the lights are out and your startup procedure works.
tfreriks
 
Posts: 84
Joined: Mon Dec 31, 2018 9:52 pm

Re: Disabling Flight Director

Postby WoodSTokk » Fri Apr 19, 2019 5:52 pm

You can add the trunk-hangar in your launcher.
* start FG
* in the launcher, go to 'Add-ons' tab
* the upper section shows 'Aircraft hangars' with the last line 'Click here to add a new aircraft hangar. …', click it
* the URL of the trunk hangar is 'http://mirrors.ibiblio.org/flightgear/ftp/Aircraft-trunk/catalog.xml'

Now you can use the latest aircrafts.
The Citation II in the trunk-hangar is updated so that the FD checkbox shows the correct setting

PS: i was never happy with the autopilot. It controls strange if you fly slow and especially approach to a ILS.
Its okay for more than 200kts, for climb out, cruise and descending near the airport.
But I deactivate the AP for the final approach and fly by hand, especially if the speed goes below 180kts.
WoodSTokk
 
Posts: 342
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2017 2:30 pm
Location: Milky Way/Sol/Earth/Europe
Callsign: OE-WST
IRC name: WoodSTokk
Version: 2018.3.1
OS: Debian Buster/Sid

Re: Disabling Flight Director

Postby tfreriks » Fri Apr 19, 2019 8:23 pm

I installed the new Citation II. I am unable to uninstall the original, however. Anyway, the FD checkbox is indeed now unchecked. But I can't engage the AP, not for HDG nor ALT and not for the RM. The AP simply doesn't now work. If I engage the FD, the plane goes nuts again, even when I'm on course and climbing nicely. Ideas?
tfreriks
 
Posts: 84
Joined: Mon Dec 31, 2018 9:52 pm

Next

Return to Flying

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests