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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby wlbragg » Sat Oct 10, 2015 7:29 pm

Thorsten wrote in Sat Oct 10, 2015 2:51 pm:
But I think the immediate problem Thorsten was having was that the exterior textures got lost. It has happened before, not to say there aren't the other problems you mentioned.


Take the shuttle to orbit at noon, and then assign space-combined.eff rather than space.eff to the gear doors - you'll spot the problem in a second. The rest of the hear shield is dark, but for some weird reason the gear doors appear in bright light. Doesn't seem to happen with the base variant of the effect.

Have you tried it since I add the textures back in and textured the gear wells?

I would go check out what you are saying but the computer I am using at the moment couldn't launch "Sputnik".
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby japreja » Sun Oct 11, 2015 4:08 am

@Richard
Do you recall where/when you got that ac importer/exporter for Blender from? I noticed that the export seems fine and doesn't alter the colors I just applied to the OMSPods, but the import of the same exported file loses the changes just exported for some reason and results in the same file that is currently in git.

OMSPods-git.ac is how they are currently in git, OMSPods.ac is what it should be (I renamed my git file to OMSPods-git.ac before I exported from blender and did the diff). Importing the new .ac will show as before it was changed, but in FlightGear it is correct with the changes. I used the default settings of the importer/exporter in blender 2.71.
Code: Select all
--- OMSPods-git.ac   2015-10-10 23:30:09.675349500 -0400
+++ OMSPods.ac   2015-10-10 13:22:49.037052700 -0400
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This patch works fine for me in FlightGear and is how it should be in that blend file I posted like so:

Image

if you import the patched file blender loses the changes :( I'd like to figure this out before I take a closer look at the windows because something is being skipped someplace in the importer you posted.
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby wlbragg » Sun Oct 11, 2015 4:30 am

@ japreja, I know this doesn't answer your questions and may not apply to your particular situation, but it may be helpful.

I would suggest we try not to import .ac files whenever possible, only the first time, before there is a .blend made of it.

In those cases, I would make a .blend with it and then everyone should use the .blend and always just export the .ac's.

It may keep things in better sync and eliminate the potential step of anyone having different import/export scripts causing issues.

Again, maybe this doesn't apply to your particular situation, just a thought.
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby japreja » Sun Oct 11, 2015 4:47 am

I did post the blend, it didn't get to the artwork folder. see post 2 pages back. Someone elses exporter didn't export it correctly, the one that is in git now. If you look at the pods in FG you will see the the color didn't take completely, only on the jets. The blend is correctly colored however. It just didn't get to the artwork folder yet.
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby Thorsten » Sun Oct 11, 2015 6:59 am

I did post the blend, it didn't get to the artwork folder.


My bad...

At least in the exported file, while diffuse color was okay, ambient color was definitely off - so there's some manual post-processing work in the committed version.
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby Johan G » Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:06 am

Though being a bit of a layman when it comes to 3D modeling, I would consider repeatedly importing and exporting a model when making changes as akin to something like repeatedly decompiling and compiling a piece of software when working on that. In essence I think it probably would be preferable to have the .blend file in the repo and not consider it as just a temporary file.
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby Thorsten » Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:14 am

'My bad...' is intended as a statement of recognition of having made an error, which in this case is having forgotten to commit the blend file to the artwork folder.
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby Hooray » Sun Oct 11, 2015 1:29 pm

http://wiki.flightgear.org/FlightGear_N ... ce_Shuttle
Image

Regarding the PUI dialog, the whole dialog could be created procedurally using ~100 lines of Nasal code, with the added benefit that an embedded Canvas (referencing the MFD) could be easily shown next to it, so that the camera/view would not need to be changed when dealing with the PFD, including dynamic tooltips (help) etc

http://wiki.flightgear.org/Howto:Creati ... FD_Dialogs
Image

The mechanism for displaying an existing Canvas requires ~5 lines of code: http://wiki.flightgear.org/Howto:Using_ ... ynamically

In fact, showing the PFD screen instead of the splash image, would only require changing a single line.

In other words, Canvas GUI dialogs can trivially show MFDs, but MFDs can also show Canvas GUI widgets (which, admittedly, won't be too useful given the nature of shuttle avionics).
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby Hooray » Sun Oct 11, 2015 3:13 pm

Where do I find the keypad PUI dialog currently ? Is it even committed or not ?
Just asking because I was going to hook up the Canvas stuff to the real thing, but need to look at the required "events" obviously.

PS: After looking for the latest branch, I ended up at some fgspaceshuttle repository that was mentioned on the wiki, and removed that from the article because it hasn't been updated in months - feel free to revert if you think that ws wrong.
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby Thorsten » Sun Oct 11, 2015 3:14 pm

OMSPods-git.ac is how they are currently in git, OMSPods.ac is what it should be


Sorry, I have no idea what you mean. The file is called OMSPods.ac here after a pull of the repo. I committed the OMSPods.blend now to artwork.

PS: After looking for the latest branch, I ended up at some fgspaceshuttle repository that was mentioned on the wiki, and removed that from the article because it hasn't been updated in months - feel free to revert if you think that ws wrong.


Try the development branch...

The file is in Dialogs/dps_keyboard.xml

However, note that this is a purely temporal solution - as soon as we start to support multiple displays, we'll have a situation in which it matters which GPC runs which software (GNC, SM or BFS), which MFD is slaved to which GPC and which keypad is assigned to which MFD - so it will in fact matter whether you type on the left or right or keypad and what MFD you're looking at, and I'm not sure I won't discontinue the dialog at all at this point since I'm not really sure how to keep this assignment then.

(In fact, many dialogs are stand-ins till the corresponding cockpit functionality works).
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby Hooray » Sun Oct 11, 2015 3:20 pm

sorry, subversion ... reverted my edits on the wiki.
http://sourceforge.net/p/fgspaceshuttle ... yboard.xml

So, found the keyboard - what about the map/pfd, can it be told to do something without having to fly the shuttle, i.e. for testing ? Or is there some pre-recorded flight/flight recorder tape that can be replayed for testing?

Regarding your edit: thanks, but then you will almost certainly begin using Canvas anyway, because multiple screens/keypads (screen selectors) are much more easily supported using Canvas placements
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby Thorsten » Sun Oct 11, 2015 3:25 pm

So, found the keyboard - what about the map/pfd, can it be told to do something without having to fly the shuttle, i.e. for testing ?


If the question is how to test it outside the Shuttle framework, you have to give it the orbital elements / inertial speed and position it reads from JSBSim.

If the question is how to test it without learning to launch the Shuttle, just initialize it in orbit by --aircraft=SpaceShuttle-orbit - it won't do anything fancy then except to go around Earth (okay, after a few hours you'll run out of water, at which point the flash evaporators will stop cooling, at which point the avionics will overheat and fail - but I'm guessing you're not waiting that long).
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby Johan G » Sun Oct 11, 2015 3:38 pm

Thorsten wrote in Sun Oct 11, 2015 7:14 am:'My bad...' is intended as a statement of recognition of having made an error, which in this case is having forgotten to commit the blend file to the artwork folder.

My apologies. It seems you posted the post prior to mine while I was composing my message.
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby Richard » Sun Oct 11, 2015 4:20 pm

Hooray wrote in Sun Oct 11, 2015 3:20 pm:will almost certainly begin using Canvas anyway, because multiple screens/keypads (screen selectors) are much more easily supported using Canvas placements


Not sure about this; I'd always imagined that we'd use the DPS entry keypads on the centre console; it's just going to take a while to get it all wired up.
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby Hooray » Sun Oct 11, 2015 4:33 pm

yes, but you would still work in terms of canvas placements, to handle multiple screens and IG sources, i.e. to support screen selectors - which can be trivially supported/prototyped using a procedurally generated keypad dialog - which could in fact be a Canvas widget easily, where you'd merely pass a corresponding ctor argument to tell the widget which screen/back-end to deal with.

Currently, the main/established practice among airliner developers is to deal with "absolute" assumptions, i.e. where a MFD cannot easily be made to work with several screens/selectors, due to a number of hard-coded constraints/assumptions.

Once you stop dealing with Canvas like that, and merely work in terms of "placements", you can easily support multiple selectors and screens, and even image sources.
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