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New Aircraft: the Extra500

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Re: New Aircraft: the Extra500

Postby TheTom » Tue Apr 01, 2014 10:48 am

I've just pushed an update to simgear: viewtopic.php?f=71&t=16984&p=204730#p204730 Please test if it helps.
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Re: New Aircraft: the Extra500

Postby D-EKEW » Tue Apr 01, 2014 5:27 pm

Looks like it does!

I was getting 12-15fps and 30-100ms frame spacing (see one of my first posts). Now I am getting (with the same settings) 15-30fps and 30-80ms. Also the scenery now (again) has a large influence. Flying over "bare" scenery (no Objects) I get 25-30fps and a remarkably steady 40-50ms as the 15fps is at an airport with lots of buildings (ELLX from the EDDF-ELLX package). Before this had no influence that I noticed indicating that on at least my system the bottleneck under certain circumstances is no longer Canvas related.
However there is still a noticeable difference between "canvas in view" and "canvas out of view". Looking outside to the left I get a bit over 50fps (vs 25-30) and as low as 20ms frame spacing.

I hope someone who had real problems (<10fps, thus un-flyable) can give some feedback?

Tom, thanks for your work!

Cheers,

Eric
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Re: New Aircraft: the Extra500

Postby Hooray » Tue Apr 01, 2014 5:49 pm

To see how much of the remaining lag is due to scenery/terrain you can use the new draw masks to toggle things on/off and evaluate performance.
Afterwards, you'll also want to compare the Canvas ND vs. the Avidyne - simply, because the former is more optimized at the moment, and the Avidyne is doing some things that are not exactly canvas friendly, and we haven't really started integrating the ND/MapStructure frameworks on the e500
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Re: New Aircraft: the Extra500

Postby someguy » Wed Apr 02, 2014 12:50 am

Maybe this will help. Here are frame rates with varying amounts of panel visible:

Image

The default pilot view yields 1-2 fps, ~610 frame spacing. Chase view is always 2 fps from any angle.

Measurements taken with no weather, very simple scenery.

FYI, the gear retracts using the hotkey, but doesn't respond to either the standard joystick button command or clicking the gear knob on the panel.
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Re: New Aircraft: the Extra500

Postby Hooray » Wed Apr 02, 2014 1:50 am

check out D-LEON's git repo, there's a special "debugging" branch that can be used to selectively disable certain parts of the instruments to see what's going on, you can also use the the system monitor.
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Re: New Aircraft: the Extra500

Postby someguy » Wed Apr 02, 2014 4:49 am

If you're talking to me, I haven't the faintest idea what a "git repo" is. I downloaded the model from the link in the first post just before making the screenies this evening.
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Re: New Aircraft: the Extra500

Postby Hooray » Wed Apr 02, 2014 11:58 am

Sorry, I didn't realize that userss with > 1k postings and a track record of over a decade of posting here may not yet know what "git" is: http://wiki.flightgear.org/Git
Which would actually seem to suggest that FlightGear is kinda becoming "user-friendly" :-)
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Re: New Aircraft: the Extra500

Postby D-EKEW » Sun Jun 22, 2014 12:12 pm

Here it is, the latest official version of the Extra500: release 1.1.0!

The Model now has reached "production" status and a small list of changes you can find below:
* Engine+fuel: realistic flame-out, fuel flow to collector compartment, anti ice influence on TOT, improved oil press and temp model
* Aerodynamics: flap performance, elevator-30deg-flaps authority improvement
* User interface: interactive checklists
* Sounds: corrected sounds for test, CWS and AP disc
* Model: added interior, yokes
* Avionics: IFD moving map, automatic NAV tuning, automatic NAV switching, magnetic variation fixes
* Autopilot: added OBS and fly vectors mode, significant improvement of coupled ILS performance

Download is in the first post, except you need to checkout 1.1.0:
Code: Select all
git checkout release/1.1.0

See also http://wiki.flightgear.org/Extra_EA-500

This version does perform a bit better on my computer, but this has to do with improvements to FGFS, not of the aircraft model. So if your computer was struggling with the initial version, we recommend to use current FGFS git/nightly builds or wait until 3.2 comes out!

Have a good flight!
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Re: New Aircraft: the Extra500

Postby Hooray » Sun Jun 22, 2014 6:26 pm

Referring to:
http://wiki.flightgear.org/Extra_EA-500 ... ist_dialog
Image
For some reason, you guys have, yet again, come up with your own version of an existing feature, without modifying/extending the existing code - this time it's the checklist dialog, but obviously your version is very much superior to the existing checklist feature, you may want to get in touch with Stuart to generalize your work and contribute it back, so that your work can be used by other aircraft and developers: http://wiki.flightgear.org/Aircraft_Checklists

Stuart's been contemplating to replace the PUI-based dialog with a custom Canvas widget for visualizing the checklist accordingly.

Personally, I am kinda surprised seeing the non-declarative nature of the implementation, given that the Avidyne Entegra R9 specifically supports checklists - how exactly do you plan to reuse the existing markup ?
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Re: New Aircraft: the Extra500

Postby D-Leon » Tue Jun 24, 2014 6:32 pm

Hooray wrote in Sun Jun 22, 2014 6:26 pm:For some reason ...


The reason is that I needed a unitest for the "cockpit pilot interface". Especially the "play" "impatient" button.

Therefor I extended the "standard checklist.xml" with my needed features. And rebuild the dialog as it is.
So the standard markup is still present you can see that by open the dialog and "Reload GUI" subsystem, then the standard dialog opens and shows the same items. This should work vice versa may bee some exception handling ? Long time i wrote that.

Hooray wrote in Sun Jun 22, 2014 6:26 pm:Personally, I am kinda surprised seeing the non-declarative nature of the implementation, given that the Avidyne Entegra R9 specifically supports checklists - how exactly do you plan to reuse the existing markup ?


Yes the IFD shows allthough checklists. ATM I dont't know how and how the Pilot interacts with it. But I don't think that the IFD can check or perform any action like the dialog. More that the pilot can mark an item as check, so far i know.
But sure I will reuse the markup source to display the checklist in the IFD.

exactly? Is that your question?
Code: Select all
onVisibiltyChange
   if visible
      for i=0; i<6 ; i++
         canvasdisplayCheckListItemAtPosition(/sim/checklists/checklist[selectedListIndex].item[scrollItemIndex+i],i)
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Re: New Aircraft: the Extra500

Postby Hooray » Tue Jun 24, 2014 6:45 pm

ok, seems like you have a plan then - don't get me wrong, this is not about disagreeing with you or your code, I am just trying to make sure that good & useful stuff can be easily reused in other places, but also maintained by others, i.e. by not being aircraft-specific. This is basically the same issue that we talked about in the context of the IFD/mapping mode vs. MapStructure:

You guys are not just average FG contributors who only just picked up programming recently, most of your code is of much higher quality than we get to see in aircraft-specific code - no matter if it's the Avidyne Entegra R9 or now the checklist.nas stuff - it's just implemented in a very use-case and aircraft-specific fashion, which I find a pity - given that there are so many opportunities for similar efforts to mutually benefit from each other. Your GUI/widget handling stuff is another example, because it's clearly overlapping with our Canvas/GUI efforts.

Overall, I'd suggest to keep the amount of aircraft/instrument-specific "code" low, and try to use separate modules (classes & files) whenever possible - most of your code could be easily useful outside the extra500, which would also mean that others, experienced contributors, could help maintain/develop such code for you.

This is not about getting involved in some "sidekick" - it's about sharing our workload and finding common/overlapping areas of work.
Currently, we have a few optimizations pending on the MapStructure side of things, from which the extra500/Avidyne Entegra R9 cannot benefit for the time being - and I am sure that you guys are also working on features that would be useful to have outside the extra500, no matter if that involves MapStructure and Canvas or not. $FG_ROOT/Nasal exists for a reason: to keep generic code outside $FG_AIRCRAFT, and to allow it to be reusable. Imagine for a second that TheTom's canvas system would only be supported by his C130J, or that the ND/map code would only be available in Gijs' 747-400 or Hyde's 777-200 - yes, coordination and collaboration can be painful at times, but it's well worth it :D
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Re: New Aircraft: the Extra500

Postby Hooray » Tue Jun 24, 2014 8:49 pm

Referring to:
Image

This looks a lot like F-JJTH's GPSMap196 standalone Canvas dialog rendering the full instrument - does that mean that you have decoupled the instrument so that it can be run without the cockpit/aircraft being loaded ? I am just asking because that would obviously be very useful to look at performance issues on the Nasal/Canvas side of things, without the aircraft (or other code) having an impact, so we could much better profile the whole thing via the built-in profiler: http://wiki.flightgear.org/Built-in_Profiler

For instance, when I open F-JJTH's GPSMap196 with 2-3 MapStructure layers, I am getting roughly 45 fps vs. "just" 25 fps with the actual aircraft:
Image
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Re: New Aircraft: the Extra500

Postby D-Leon » Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:11 pm

No that picture is live out of the extra500. It is not possible to run it stand alone. The instruments have to drive the IFD otherwise you can put the svg files in a canvas window and write a simulater for the instruments ? or just burst the rendering with a loop?

If im flying without terrain(/sim/rending/draw-mask/terrain=false) i get 30-40fps depends on the MAP-Map range on the right IFD. Im interrested in your results!
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Re: New Aircraft: the Extra500

Postby Hooray » Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:37 pm

getting a bunch of loadxml related "security" warnings and errors when using --aircraft-dir= I suppose IORules has to be edited ?
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Re: New Aircraft: the Extra500

Postby D-Leon » Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:56 pm

Hooray wrote in Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:37 pm:getting a bunch of loadxml related "security" warnings and errors when using --aircraft-dir= I suppose IORules has to be edited ?

No the IORules don't have to be edit!
I use --aircraft-dir=~/customAircraft
~/customAircraft/extra500 is a link to the repro
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