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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby Thorsten » Tue Nov 23, 2021 7:13 pm

This should really be in Space Shuttle - Help, but did you check the 'Troubleshooting' section in 'The Manual' and make sure all items are covered?
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby TheEagle » Tue Nov 23, 2021 7:33 pm

Where can I find "The Manual" ?
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby Thorsten » Wed Nov 24, 2021 6:37 pm

On my webpage (not quite sure how one can miss that, as it's mentioned in the in-sim help function and discussed several times here in the forum... but feel free to tell me how else one can make it more prominent :D )
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby Gomendio » Fri Nov 26, 2021 11:49 am

thug astro...

Asking thorsten about "where it can be found the manual...".
Reminds me a funny guy years ago during LOFT sessions onto the Level D sim, "Advance non normal handling" was the topic of the day,
¿Where is the damned gear lever in this box??

You could hear a pin dropped...
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby Thorsten » Fri Nov 26, 2021 6:37 pm

Sorry, is there any meaning to your message? Because I sure can't make it out.
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby TheEagle » Fri Nov 26, 2021 6:48 pm

Well there is no gear lever in a Space Shuttle, right ? At least I have searched for it in vain … :mrgreen:
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby electricfalcon » Thu Jan 20, 2022 9:56 pm

Hi,

Great work on this add-on! I hate to be the rival asking for help but I'm looking to work on a unity based VR shuttle sim (hopefully as study level as possible). Think reentry orbital simulator but for the shuttle. GinGin actually sent me over from the reentry discord.

I was really looking for some good references on the flight deck panels, specifically switch layout and dimensions for each panel to aid with the modelling. I was wondering whether you guys know of the best place for this. I've been trying to use the 3d photospheres currently, but the zoom level hasn't been helpful.

Any help would be appreciated.

Anthony
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby wlbragg » Thu Jan 20, 2022 10:22 pm

Unfortunately I am in-between computer setups and have no easy access to anything, but there should be a Crew Reference manual floating around with much of what you might need. I am not sure about it having dimensions though. NASA website should have everything you might want to know about it I would think though. They are pretty open about such historical data.
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby TheEagle » Fri Jan 21, 2022 12:33 am

Maybe I'm talking complete nonsense, but can't you simply take the FG model and convert it to a compatible format ?
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby Thorsten » Fri Jan 21, 2022 6:26 am

Maybe I'm talking complete nonsense, but can't you simply take the FG model and convert it to a compatible format ?


You could, but this would determine how you have to license everything else - which may not be desirable or even feasible.
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby electricfalcon » Mon Jan 24, 2022 11:13 am

TheEagle wrote in Fri Jan 21, 2022 12:33 am:Maybe I'm talking complete nonsense, but can't you simply take the FG model and convert it to a compatible format ?


Yeah my aim was to create the assets myself for licensing issues. The fg shuttle is GPLv3 which means I don't think I could use the 3d model assets in a commercial product.

However I assume it would be ok to use the 3D model as a reference when creating my own model asset for the flight deck? Obviously this means there might be a lot of referential overlaps in both assets, but it'd be completely made from scratch.
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby wkitty42 » Mon Jan 24, 2022 1:52 pm

the FG shuttle model is derived directly from the public domain one published by NASA... if you don't think you can use the one from FG, you could start with the one from NASA just like the FG one did ;)
"You get more air close to the ground," said Angalo. "I read that in a book. You get lots of air low down, and not much when you go up."
"Why not?" said Gurder.
"Dunno. It's frightened of heights, I guess."
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby electricfalcon » Mon Jan 24, 2022 7:56 pm

wkitty42 wrote in Mon Jan 24, 2022 1:52 pm:the FG shuttle model is derived directly from the public domain one published by NASA... if you don't think you can use the one from FG, you could start with the one from NASA just like the FG one did ;)


I can't seem to find a NASA shuttle cockpit model, could you link me to it?
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby wkitty42 » Mon Jan 24, 2022 10:09 pm

for all i know, it was part of the shuttle model... wlbragg in these forums can probably tell you a lot more since, IIRC, he did a lot of the modeling work on the shuttle we see and fly today...

actually, since i don't know if you have FG installed and the SpaceShuttle installed from the default hanger, i'll quote the AUTHORS file from it for you...
The Space Shuttle modeling lives off the fact that NASA has made thousands of technical papers freely available, numerous of these resources have been used.

The various aspects of the modeling have been carried out by the following people:

Flight dynamics:

* based on various NASA technical papers by Thorsten Renk

Exterior 3d model:

* original taken from NASA under public domain, adapted from Herbert Wagner under GPL
* for this project, modified and extended by Richard Harrison, Wayne Bragg and japreja

Interior cockpit 3d model:

* original by Chris Kuhn
* adapted for this project by Richard Harrison with permission from Chris Kuhn
* photo textures based on the panoramas of Jon Brack http://www.jonbrack360.com/shuttle/
* animated and modified by Wayne Bragg

Effects and Shaders:

* few adapted from Herbert Wagner under GPL
* for this project extended by Thorsten Renk and Wayne Bragg

Systems modeling:

* based on the Space Shuttle Crew Operations Manual by Thorsten Renk

Sounds:

* adapted from Victor Slavutinsky for Vostok-1 under GPL by Herbert Wagner
* modified for this project by Thorsten Renk

Alternative MDU fonts:

* created by the SSU Team, adapted from Orbiter SSU project under LGPL

Carrier aircraft 3d model:

* Grupo FGBr, Martien van der Plas (SCA conversion), adapted by Jorge Pareja under GPL

hopefully one of those mentioned gentle can point you further as i don't recall where their development repo is...
"You get more air close to the ground," said Angalo. "I read that in a book. You get lots of air low down, and not much when you go up."
"Why not?" said Gurder.
"Dunno. It's frightened of heights, I guess."
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Re: Space Shuttle

Postby Thorsten » Tue Jan 25, 2022 7:28 am

which means I don't think I could use the 3d model assets in a commercial product.


Yes and no - you could still sell it, but you'd have to license it GPL and would have to keep all sources accessible.

However I assume it would be ok to use the 3D model as a reference when creating my own model asset for the flight deck?


Grey area. Facts cannot be copyrighted, so to the degree that you use the information 'this switch is at position such and such' (which is a fact) that's clearly okay. To the degree that you use inspiration how the mesh is organized it is not.

However, if you're after creating a commercial product, you could simply buy the license for the original cockpit mesh from Chris Kuhn - to my knowledge he had the deluxe textured version for sale (and gave us permission to use the plan version for our purpose).

Otherwise, please understand that as an OpenSource coder, my willingness to help with commercial product development is... low.
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