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Postby jano » Mon Sep 23, 2013 10:38 pm

here's a screen from a french user, testing the 2.12 rc, showing how is the message box:

Image

system information:

Image

this is on a windows XP with an intel 910 GL.

the french topic: http://fr.flightgear.org/forums/viewtopic.php?id=2657

any clue?

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Re: white popup message

Postby zakalawe » Tue Sep 24, 2013 8:41 am

Seems like the canvas content didn't render correctly, this is the first occurrence of such an issue I'm aware of. Do other Canvas-based displays work? Easiest test is the airfield chart in the airports dialog.
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Re: white popup message

Postby Gijs » Tue Sep 24, 2013 8:59 am

Also make sure to check the console for errors. I think I've always seen some Nasal errors when I encountered a white Canvas...
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Re: white popup message

Postby Hooray » Tue Sep 24, 2013 1:01 pm

I *think* Philosopher opened a merge request with a bugfix (purely Nasal/fgdata) for this a couple of weeks ago...
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Re: white popup message

Postby Philosopher » Tue Sep 24, 2013 1:09 pm

No, that was just regarding closing behavior ;)
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Re: white popup message

Postby jano » Tue Sep 24, 2013 9:09 pm

james: here we go for the airport chart, a nice full white :)

Image



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Re: white popup message

Postby Hooray » Tue Sep 24, 2013 9:15 pm

what's the exact GPU in those cases (see help/about dialog) ?
does the c172p canvas demo work ?
are you able to use other offscreen-rendering targets like od_gauge based instruments (wxradar, tcas etc) - and what about the map dialog (which is NOT od_gauge, but still interesting to know).
could you please also post the log file (--log-level=debug) to see if there's anything rendering/canvas related
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Re: white popup message

Postby Hooray » Wed Oct 16, 2013 7:17 pm

intel 910 GL

Do we have anybody else with this "GPU" ?
It would be interesting to know if the issue is GPU specific or not, if that's the case, that would suggest that the od_gauge RTT couldn't be acquired ?
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Re: white popup message

Postby f-ojac » Sat Oct 19, 2013 8:04 pm

We have another FR user with the following config: Windows XP Home SP3 ; Intel Pentium M processor 1,50GHz ; 2.0GB RAM ; Intel 82852/82855 GM/GME Graphic Controler having the same trouble.
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Re: white popup message

Postby zakalawe » Sun Oct 20, 2013 9:16 am

Unfortunately there is obviously a driver bug or genuine hardware limitation on these really old Intel chipsets. I think we might need to consider officially un-supporting them from 3.0 (since we can already detect the vendor as Intel). I believe 940-class chips are okay, and the 2000/3000/4000HD versions seem to work, but the earlier 9xx and before are going to be problematic.

(I'm also surprised the sim can run at usable frame-rate on such hardware, even ignoring the FBO problems!)
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Re: white popup message

Postby Hooray » Sun Oct 20, 2013 9:34 am

First of all, I'd suggest to upgrade to the latest driver version - often, unsupported features are emulated via CPU extensions.

Back in the day, there were usually workarounds possible to accomplish RTT even without FBO support (i.e. pbuffer rendering etc) - according to the intel website, RTT was supported through some custom extensions on 910/915 hardware - so it's probably a matter of telling OSG to make use of these features in some form of fallback mode, possibly in the od_gauge backend code.

Do any of the other hard coded instruments work, such as 1) NavDisplay, 2) wxradar, 3) agradar - and what about the map dialog (doesn't use the canvas and neither the od_gauge stuff)? That would at least tell us what's supported and working, and what isn't ...

If any of these work, it should be technically possible to also support them in the canvas backend code - OSG still supports pbuffer mode instead of FBOs:

http://lists.openscenegraph.org/htdig.c ... 02068.html
http://lists.openscenegraph.org/htdig.c ... 03614.html
http://lists.openscenegraph.org/htdig.c ... 04790.html
http://lists.openscenegraph.org/htdig.c ... 16274.html
http://lists.openscenegraph.org/htdig.c ... 31877.html
http://lists.openscenegraph.org/htdig.c ... 50332.html

you could use a Pixel Buffer(Pbuffer) for better compability. Check out the osgprerender example. Basically you use PIXEL_BUFFER_RTT or PIXEL_BUFFER instead of FRAME_BUFFER_OBJECT. But from Roberts answer I understand that this shouldn't be necessary.

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Re: white popup message

Postby f-ojac » Sun Oct 20, 2013 11:09 am

Quoting user dood on IRC : "That white box thingy happens on old nvidia h/w too: Mx400 As you say, it's amazing it works at all."
So yes, for now FG works for those users, of course not with all bells and whistles. Thinking about all (? don''t know how many they are) of them, probably having a workaround would be better for those users than just unsupporting those graphic cards and say "hey, buy a new PC/graphic card" ?
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Re: white popup message

Postby Hooray » Sun Oct 20, 2013 11:17 am

At the moment, this clearly isn't critical - because these cards are obviously very outdated and most FG features cannot expected to work on these types of hardware anyway (and 2.12 has just been released) - on the other hand, once more and more features are ported to make use of the canvas as the common 2D rendering backend (HUD, 2Dpanel, GUI etc), it would be good to know if this could be solved by optoinally using pbuffer rendering instead of FBOs as a fallback - but even just knowing if other hardcoded MFD instruments or the map dialog work, would be interesting.

Thinking along the lines of having a more basic startup mode in FlightGear, analogous to FGPanel/FGCanvas, it would be not that far-fetched that people may be using their old hardware to run multi-screen setups or other master/slave configurations, where just requiring FBOs for all machines may not be the best option.

So, again, if you are affected or know someone who is affected, please ask them to provide feedback, specifically:
- do airliners/jets with the wxradar/agradar, NavDisplay etc work or not ?
- does the map dialog work ?

If in doubt, please just post screen shots

Also, you could ask them to check if support for multiple windows works, because that should also be using offscreen-rendering internally: http://wiki.flightgear.org/Howto:Config ... ew_windows

PS: @TheTom: If in doubt, I'd suggest to get in touch with FredB, according to the devel list, he's using pbuffer fallback mode for the rembrandt/deferred rendering mode to get offscreen rendering support.
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Re: white popup message

Postby Tomaskom » Fri Aug 29, 2014 7:23 am

zakalawe wrote in Sun Oct 20, 2013 9:16 am:Unfortunately there is obviously a driver bug or genuine hardware limitation on these really old Intel chipsets. I think we might need to consider officially un-supporting them from 3.0 (since we can already detect the vendor as Intel). I believe 940-class chips are okay, and the 2000/3000/4000HD versions seem to work, but the earlier 9xx and before are going to be problematic.

(I'm also surprised the sim can run at usable frame-rate on such hardware, even ignoring the FBO problems!)

I'm running on a laptop with i5-2450M CPU, just the integrated graphics (Intel HD 3000). And I'm on Linux.

Previously, I was barely able to get reasonable framerates, Rembrandt didn't work at all (almost everything black) and some visual glitches were present here and there.
Since I updated my system to newer version (with kernel 3.11) in January, the new graphics drives meant a revolution for me. Suddenly I was able to fly reasonably even with the new high-poly scenery (of course most shaders on minimum), Rembrandt works so I could finally add Rembrandt support to my aircraft etc. :)
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