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FG 2.10.0 prerelease for Mac won't start

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Re: FG 2.10.0 prerelease for Mac won't start

Postby fmg » Thu Jan 31, 2013 1:41 pm

zakalawe wrote in Thu Jan 31, 2013 12:54 pm:BTW does the 'ATI hack' fix the viewport issue? I never had a problem with my Radeon 3870 or 5770 on Mac, so I'm surprised you are still encountering it.


Hi zakalawe,
not sure what you mean with the viewport issue. Maybe this http://flightgear.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=18757&p=175595&hilit=ATI+hack&sid=f0e2a47aa175a80036b149faea4db988&sid=f0e2a47aa175a80036b149faea4db988#p175595.
If yes, than I'm afraid it is not my issue no. 2 and the ATI hack does not fix it. This is how looks like:

Image
And the border around the FG image is wild flickering.

But as I remember Tat gave some explanations about a solution for it in the link I offer t before.
Last edited by fmg on Sun Jun 09, 2013 9:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: FG 2.10.0 prerelease for Mac won't start

Postby zakalawe » Thu Jan 31, 2013 6:20 pm

As I recall, Tat's fix was to use the Carbon viewer, but that option has basically expired.
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Re: FG 2.10.0 prerelease for Mac won't start

Postby Zhuangt98 » Sat Feb 02, 2013 7:00 am

Hi there,

There is a problem with the new mac FG V2.10, where the scenery models in "data/scenery" folder isn't used when FlightGear is launched. I then found out that the folder "TerraSync" is located in "Users/Library/Application Support/FlightGear", and the custom scenery models would not show when there is data in the TerraSync folder. One good example is when you start flightgear fresh on KSFO where by default, you should be on the runway as the scenery is already in the "data/scenery" folder, but i land in the sea as there is no terrain. I experimented by deleting the "TerraSync" folder and then FG will use the data found in the "scenery" folder, where i start on KSFO's runway.

Ok, so I would like the developer to fix this problem whereby when you install custom scenery, it is shown together with the terrasynced terrain and maybe change the directory of where the terrasync folder is, into the default flightgear data folder like it was in FG 2.4 and 2.6 because there was no such problems then.

Thanks! :)
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Re: FG 2.10.0 prerelease for Mac won't start

Postby zakalawe » Sat Feb 02, 2013 8:45 am

All the scenery paths should be used at the same time - your custom one, the TerraSync path in appSupport, and the base package KSFO scenery in data. It sounds as if that's not working for you - can you please describe exactly what you have installed, and where, and what options you are setting?

When you specify additional scenery paths, the code is supposed to automatically add the TerraSync path and the data path to the end of the search list. That works here, and for most people - so hopefully with some details we can make it work for you.
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Re: FG 2.10.0 prerelease for Mac won't start

Postby fmg » Sun Feb 03, 2013 1:07 am

Hello,

tested the new build 2.10.0 #374 today. Great progress. The numeric keypad and also the View options button is working again. Also allot of thanks for explaining about the new paths where FG now saved some of it's settings. Good to know. Changed the TerraSync scenery path there and it works. So points 1, 5 and 9 of my list are solved.

2. Window resizing:
Rescaling the window: stayed the same, except that the new parts of the window are no longer filled with graphic jam. Now they are white.

3. HUDs:
I'm having a look for the HUD now and getting more and more confused. The code of the minimal HUD haven't changed, but the property /position/alpha that is used for the AOA value seemed no longer be calculated by the sim. It always is zero and so the HUD is displaying this correctly. Unfortunately I didn't find another property that could be used for that.
Also the autopilot section isn't displayed any longer in the minimal HUD. By looking for this one I wonder how this was displayed before, because I can't find it in the minimal.xml. Even if I copy the call from the default HUD, where it is still displayed, in there it won't appear. Code below.
Code: Select all
   <import>
      <path>Huds/Sets/autopilot.xml</path>
      <x-offset>-100</x-offset>
      <y-offset>160</y-offset>
   </import>

Maybe I can go on there later. Any tips?

6. Airport dialog:
On my system there still is the delay with about 40 seconds. And it get's worse. After loading the dialog window of the airport dialog only the terrain gets loaded. No models are shown until the scenery was reloaded manually.
On the airport map the tower is displayed in the airport position, not on the tower position.
Parking position list can't be scrolled and is truncated by the window border. If you have many of them you can't choose all that is above.
On the right the airport you are on is shown, and on it's position the result of the <100nm button is calculated. But it is not activated. So you are not able to choose runways or parking positions until you do a search for the airport already displayed and activate it. Maybe it is better, if the airport displayed is also choose n, that you can directly access runways and so on.

Shader:
I have issues with skydome scattering an some of the shaders. If Transition is greater then step two the grass becomes dark brown. Same happened to the global city land class if the urban shader is on. This didn't happen with the regional-specific version.

Frame rates:
About frame rate: I discovered, that there came a incomplete version of shared models with the release. So lots of models wasn't loaded during my first tests. Now it goes down to 15/16 fps with skydome scattering and without 19/20 fps.
Was 19/20 fps with skydome scattering on and 24/25 fps without in the first test.
In FG 2.6-r319 it is 29/30fps.

Thats all for now.

f-)
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Re: FG 2.10.0 prerelease for Mac won't start

Postby Zhuangt98 » Sun Feb 03, 2013 3:02 am

Hi Kakalawe,

zakalawe wrote in Sat Feb 02, 2013 8:45 am:All the scenery paths should be used at the same time - your custom one, the TerraSync path in appSupport, and the base package KSFO scenery in data. It sounds as if that's not working for you - can you please describe exactly what you have installed, and where, and what options you are setting?


For me, I did not change any settings or options for the FlightGear TerraSync path, I just used FlightGear after downloading. By default, when i pressed the "scenery download" button under environment, the path there already says that its directory is in Application Support. And the two scenery data are not used at the same time. So only TerraSync data are used and no Scenery data are used. That's the problem. Take this for example: I downloaded the airport model for Hong Kong International Airport, I will use TerraSync to download the terrain for that area and then place the downloaded files into the data/scenery folder, but in the end no airport models from the downloaded package is shown.

zakalawe wrote in Sat Feb 02, 2013 8:45 am:When you specify additional scenery paths, the code is supposed to automatically add the TerraSync path and the data path to the end of the search list. That works here, and for most people - so hopefully with some details we can make it work for you.

For that, I did not specify additional scenery paths.

Btw, i use the old 2010 macbook pro with mac os 10.6.8. I wonder if that would affect.
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Re: FG 2.10.0 prerelease for Mac won't start

Postby Hooray » Sun Feb 03, 2013 3:14 am

fmg wrote:2. Window resizing:
Rescaling the window: stayed the same, except that the new parts of the window are no longer filled with graphic jam. Now they are white.


It's just a stab in the dark, but is there any way for you to check if the same problem persists with other OpenGL-based applications ? If this is just an FG-specific issue, it would be great if you could check if fgviewer or other osgviewer-based applications work properly or not - that would tell us if the problem is really specific to FG or if it could be OSG related. Also, maybe post a screenshot of the about dialog showing all version info of the libraries (especially OSG).

6. Airport dialog:
On my system there still is the delay with about 40 seconds.

Like Zakalawe mentioned earlier, such things are incredibly tricky to troubleshoot for developers who don't have these problems. Access to a debugger like gdb would help a little, to see what's going on - but obviously requires familiarity using a debugger.
On a Linux/Unix-based system, providing a remote shell access (SSH) would be another option - so that someone could log into your machine have a look, not sure if that's a viable option here ?
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Re: FG 2.10.0 prerelease for Mac won't start

Postby someguy » Sun Feb 03, 2013 5:45 am

Yesterday, the airport dialog was near-instantaneous for me. Today, it's a 30-plus-second spinning-beachball freeze. I think the difference was going from RC1 to RC2. It takes that long on every try, not just the first in each spawn session.
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Re: FG 2.10.0 prerelease for Mac won't start

Postby zakalawe » Sun Feb 03, 2013 9:38 am

Okay, that's a good data-point. I take it closing and re-launching makes no difference? I don't think it's the build number that matters, but it seems something pseudo-random is going on. Very weird.

Those symptoms are what I was seeing during December, but I made some tweaks and the issue went away for me. Obviously it's not really fixed, simply less likely to happen. Unfortunately this doesn't help with working out what the root cause is.
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Re: FG 2.10.0 prerelease for Mac won't start

Postby someguy » Sun Feb 03, 2013 3:33 pm

Anyone else old enough to remember the FORTRAN game Black Box? :)
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Re: FG 2.10.0 prerelease for Mac won't start

Postby fmg » Sun Feb 03, 2013 6:31 pm

No idea if this might be helpful. I run log level debug during a call of the airport dialog. This is the last part of it:
Code: Select all
untie of /sim[0]/hitches[0]/aerotow[0]/tow[0]/elastic-constant[0]
untie of /sim[0]/hitches[0]/aerotow[0]/tow[0]/length[0]
clearing 3154819
clearing 3154827
clearing 3154835
clearing 3154843
clearing 3154851
clearing 3154859
clearing 3154867
clearing 3171200
clearing 3171201
clearing 3171202
clearing 3171203
clearing 3171208
clearing 3171209
clearing 3171210
clearing 3171211
clearing 3171216
clearing 3171217
clearing 3171218
clearing 3171219
clearing 3171224
clearing 3171225
clearing 3171226
clearing 3171227
clearing 3171232
clearing 3171233
clearing 3171234
clearing 3171235
clearing 3171240
clearing 3171241
clearing 3171242
clearing 3171243
clearing 3171248
clearing 3171249
clearing 3171250
clearing 3171251
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3154819
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e574f0
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3154827
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e4dfd0
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3154835
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e6df60
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3154843
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e6e060
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3154851
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e6e160
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3154859
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e6d1e0
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3154867
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e6d2e0
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171200
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e6d3e0
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171201
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e6ff80
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171202
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e706b0
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171203
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e711a0
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171208
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e59880
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171209
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e70080
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171210
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e70840
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171211
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e71330
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171216
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e59980
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171217
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e70280
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171218
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e709d0
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171219
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e714c0
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171224
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e59a80
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171225
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e58050
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171226
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e70b60
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171227
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e71650
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171232
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e6fc80
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171233
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e70380
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171234
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e70cf0
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171235
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e717e0
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171240
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e6fd80
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171241
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e70480
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171242
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e70e80
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171243
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e71b40
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171248
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e6fe80
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171249
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e70580
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171250
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e71010
FREEING CACHE ENTRY = 3171251
disconnecting TileEntry nodes
removing a fully loaded tile!  _node = 0x122e71c40
SGMaterialLib::~SGMaterialLib() size=283
closing the navcache

Looks like FG unloaded all tiles before displaying the dialog. Wouldn't this be better, while going to a different airport after closing the dialog?
I also made an analyze of the FG process with the mac activity monitor. If this could help I can also post it.

Build # 374
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Re: FG 2.10.0 prerelease for Mac won't start

Postby Hooray » Sun Feb 03, 2013 8:47 pm

Don't know if the mac RC contains profiling support, but you could check if fgcommand("profiler-start"); works in the Nasal console, if it does, follow the instructions at: viewtopic.php?f=68&t=18839&start=15#p175689
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Re: FG 2.10.0 prerelease for Mac won't start

Postby fmg » Sun Feb 03, 2013 10:08 pm

Hooray wrote in Sun Feb 03, 2013 8:47 pm:Don't know if the mac RC contains profiling support, but you could check if fgcommand("profiler-start"); works in the Nasal console, if it does, follow the instructions at: http://flightgear.org/forums/viewtopic. ... 15#p175689

Unfortunately no profiler-support.
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Re: FG 2.10.0 prerelease for Mac won't start

Postby Johan G » Mon Feb 04, 2013 8:09 pm

someguy wrote in Sun Feb 03, 2013 3:33 pm:...the FORTRAN game Black Box? :)

Is it related to WP:Black Box (game)?
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Re: FG 2.10.0 prerelease for Mac won't start

Postby fmg » Mon Feb 04, 2013 9:20 pm

Hi,

just made a test with the new build 375 and now the airport dialog appears instantly and the scenery stays loaded. So a great progress. By the way: seemed that I can't type in the fields for runway and park pos in the dialog.

Keep up the good work.

f-)
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