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FG 3.4 RC2

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FG 3.4 RC2

Postby Tomaskom » Wed Feb 11, 2015 4:04 pm

I compiled the latest RC on my Linux system, here are my findings and issues I noticed:

During compilation, multiple warnings were issued by the compiler (gcc 4.8.1), see this paste: http://pastebin.com/wQwg9BuV
Some of those are harmless (unused variables), some are fine as long as one knows what he is doing (comparing signed and unsigned types), some might be a cause of serious problems (possible use of uninitialized variables, reaching over array bounds, ...)


In-sim issues:

AI/MP LOD ranges - AI aircraft seem to be visible on very short distances only, setting smaller value causes longer visibility range! Default value causes too short visibility. Something is obviously wrong in the range calculation or comparison.

Submodels are visible over insanely short range or not at all. Weird dependance on AI/MP LOD range observed (similar as for AI aircraft), default value causes too short visibility. In case where the submodel is a bullet that is set to explode upon impact and the bullet is out of the visible range, the explosion is visible ONLY with Rembrandt on (there should be no difference between Rembrandt and standard rendering shemes in this regard).
In older versions, submodel visibility range was not limited (AFAIK), only by dist-scale and range animations on the submodel object itself. I think it should remain this way (or have a separate setting). Submodels aren't likely to cause problems because of their limited lifetime, contrary to the AI aircraft, where the range limitiation is obviously needed.

Earthview orbital rendering - When turned on, it confuses the AGL value as seen on the HUD. Also flyby view in dive causes view from below the (fake) surface which is placed very close. At about 100k ft the AGL value was a few hundred ft or less. When the Earthview orbital rendering was turned on on rather low altitudes (I know it in not to be used that way), it could cause aircraft crash into the fake surface.
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Re: FG 3.4 RC2

Postby Torsten » Wed Feb 11, 2015 4:37 pm

Thanks for the feedback.
Usually the flightgear-devel mailing list is a better place for these information as most core developers do not follow the forum.

The ai-detailed property now has two meanings, either it is range or pixels on screen.
See here:
https://gitorious.org/fg/fgdata/source/ ... l#L160-174

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Re: FG 3.4 RC2

Postby Thorsten » Wed Feb 11, 2015 4:41 pm

Earthview orbital rendering - When turned on, it confuses the AGL value as seen on the HUD. Also flyby view in dive causes view from below the (fake) surface which is placed very close. At about 100k ft the AGL value was a few hundred ft or less. When the Earthview orbital rendering was turned on on rather low altitudes (I know it in not to be used that way), it could cause aircraft crash into the fake surface.


It assumes you're well on your way into orbit. It starts working from 50 km altitude and above. So that's not a bug but just misuse of the feature :-)

I think it'd be a good idea to make a note on the GUI that the value is in pixels - we've had more than one user confused by now.
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Re: FG 3.4 RC2

Postby Tomaskom » Wed Feb 11, 2015 5:30 pm

Thorsten wrote in Wed Feb 11, 2015 4:41 pm:I think it'd be a good idea to make a note on the GUI that the value is in pixels - we've had more than one user confused by now.

What is most confusing is that it is in a dialog, where on the top it says "Max ranges (m)"
So, that value means something like "show if it is larger than X pixels". Is it the largerst dimension of the object or a total number of pixels it occupies?
Anyway, the default value should be way smaller. I'm using a rather low resolution (1366x768) and the range is below hundred meters (guess) even for large airliners.

Submodels should definitely not be influenced by this. Currently the behavior is weird and I can't exactly say how they are influenced, but is seems their visibility range depends on the AI/MP range in some way.
When not visible, they are still tracked (I have listener on the impact reporting property which notifies me), but the impact animation (releasing particles) is gone. What I do is to use blank (invisible) submodels for bullets (with impact) and visible submodels for tracers (without impact animation). Anything related to pixels kills this use-case completely.

Torsten wrote in Wed Feb 11, 2015 4:37 pm:Thanks for the feedback.
Usually the flightgear-devel mailing list is a better place for these information as most core developers do not follow the forum.

I'll have a look there.

Thorsten wrote in Wed Feb 11, 2015 4:41 pm:It assumes you're well on your way into orbit. It starts working from 50 km altitude and above. So that's not a bug but just misuse of the feature :-)

I understand, but it shouldn't be "hot" (in terms of crashing) and AGL should not detect it as a surface and rather show height above sea level, not a few hundred feet.

One more thing: when switching views, pressing Tab to change mouse function etc., the popup message sometimes fails to disappear (unless it is replaced by another). This was present in older versions too.
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Re: FG 3.4 RC2

Postby Thorsten » Wed Feb 11, 2015 6:01 pm

I understand, but it shouldn't be "hot" (in terms of crashing) and AGL should not detect it as a surface and rather show height above sea level, not a few hundred feet.


I doubt spacecraft are flown by AGL height, what matters is orbital radius, so I don't see that it matters either way. There's plenty of ways in which Earthview and FG could be merged into a smoother experience and I'll probably go there again eventually, but I can't really say this justifies urgent action or by itself makes a huge difference. So I'll get to it eventually, but not with high priority.
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Re: FG 3.4 RC2

Postby Tomaskom » Wed Feb 11, 2015 9:41 pm

Thorsten wrote in Wed Feb 11, 2015 6:01 pm:I doubt spacecraft are flown by AGL height, what matters is orbital radius, so I don't see that it matters either way. There's plenty of ways in which Earthview and FG could be merged into a smoother experience and I'll probably go there again eventually, but I can't really say this justifies urgent action or by itself makes a huge difference. So I'll get to it eventually, but not with high priority.

As long as you're not disturbed by some continuous low altitude warning :D
Well, of course it's not anything critical, the whole thing is rather experimental anyway. I just wanted to mention it as something I noticed.
(Also I think the rendering should be based on current camera position, not the aircraft/rocket/whatever position, like easily seen in flyby view when descending.)

One more thing I tried regarding the AI/MP range:
A scenario like this http://fguk.eu/index.php/hangar/viewdow ... -mach-loop is practically unusable even when I set a value 1, sometimes the rings marking the way appear just a few seconds of flight in front of me. Normally they can be easily seen from a few miles away, so the size calculation seems to be glitchy. Whatever is happening, that setting obviously affects much more stuff than it should and often fails to work properly.
As I currently see it, it causes more harm than good. The idea itself is very nice, but the current implementation simply causes me lots of problems.
"There are no problems in the air. The only problem is hitting the ground"

Get my L-159 ALCA from the FGUK hangar. If you crash it, things gonna go boom!
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Re: FG 3.4 RC2

Postby enrogue » Wed Feb 11, 2015 10:17 pm

I'm having a similar issue with the /sim/rendering/static-lod/ai-detailed setting

My Ryan Firebee uses a JATO launcher which is dropped as the thrust cuts using an AI submodel that has a particle smoke trail attached - with the default setting it never appears in any view (including the smoke trail) - not even when running full screen at 1920x1080 when zoomed into view the model, so I'm not sure what it's using to calculate the pixel size.

I seem to be only to be able to view it dropping from the model when using tower view now, when the ai-detailed is set to 1

It's always visible in 3.2 - here is a sequence of screenshots of a launch from EGOD:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/434 ... en-018.png
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/434 ... en-019.png
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/434 ... en-020.png
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Re: FG 3.4 RC2

Postby jsb » Wed Feb 18, 2015 9:48 pm

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Re: FG 3.4 RC2

Postby radi » Thu Feb 19, 2015 3:18 am

Did you (accidentally) enable EarthView orbital rendering? I think it's in the view menu.
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Re: FG 3.4 RC2

Postby jsb » Thu Feb 19, 2015 5:08 pm

Right... I thought I could configure ALS in that menu and did not think too much about "orbital" - my fault.
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