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Estonia - Scenery developement

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Re: Estonia - Scenery developement

Postby Alral » Thu Mar 05, 2015 4:08 pm

Version 2.8.
Testing on my laptop. Intel Core2Duo P8400. 4.0 GB RAM (though just 2GB is available for FG due to 32bit system). NVidia GeForce 9650GT 1GB.
Windows Vista 32bit.

Tallinn.
"With forest" means random vegetation density 1.9 (I prefer it when forest looks like one).
UFO. Facing that Õismäe quarter:
With forest (density 1.9) enabled FPS 24.
Forest disabled - FPS 44-50.

Observing Lasnamäe from the airport.
Forest enabled: 25
Forest disabled: 50

Some directions with massive forest bodies - FPS around 20

Facing Kopli from somewhere around Paldiski maantee.
No effect from disabling/enabling forest. Stable 30 FPS. Forest parts are pretty small here though (Merimets, Kopli Kalmistupark and Paljassaare). Setting Water shader to minumum gives 60 FPS.

Removed ALL objects (simply renaming stg-files).
With forest and max water: FPS stable on all directions about 30.
With no forest and with max water: FPS about 30 when facing the sea or Ülemiste lake, ~50-60 otherwise.
With no forest and min water: FPS about 60 in all directions
With forest and min water: FPS from 50 (facing sea) to 20 (facing forest to the South of the airport).

So, just how it works for me:
The biggest FPS-eaters seem to be Random vegetation and Water shader. I am using scenery from my pack - OSM/2.0 scenery should be presumably giving poorer results due to being more complicated.
Objects do affect FPS, but not that bad as they would seem to be.
Removing all the objects gives obviously smaller memory consumption, though not by that much as expected (around 200MB, if I am not mistaking, but cannot be sure).

Would be interesting to compare these results with other people.
http://www.flightgear.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=9312

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Re: Estonia - Scenery developement

Postby henrikp » Mon Mar 09, 2015 8:32 pm

Since Alral did a nice terminal building for EERU, I had to add some more scenery and make a separate release: http://flightgear.ahven.eu/files/EERU.zip
Also added a simple file lister to http://flightgear.ahven.eu/
EEKA is still partial, hopefully have more free time soon :)
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Re: Estonia - Scenery developement

Postby Alral » Wed Mar 11, 2015 12:16 am

Image

Landings can be a little tricky though (a small airfield on an island far from the mainland, easy to miss the island, with any luck possible to overrun into the sea), but a pretty nice place anyhow. More buildings will appear eventually (I hope) so that there comes something to look at.
http://www.flightgear.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=9312

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Re: Estonia - Scenery developement

Postby henrikp » Thu Mar 19, 2015 9:36 pm

EERU
Image
http://flightgear.ahven.eu/files/EERU.zip
I can pretty much put a v1.0 sticker on this. Big thanks to Alral for all the custom buildings and ship(s)!

EEKE and EESE
Image
http://flightgear.ahven.eu/files/EEKE-EESE.zip
EEKE - airport layout done and Alral updated the terminal building, nothing else yet.
EESE - just a helipad and a windsock for now.
Now back to my regular schedule.
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Re: Estonia - Scenery developement

Postby legoboyvdlp » Thu Mar 19, 2015 11:45 pm

Nice! Beautiful. Good job!
Does the apt.dat include eddf 07LCR/25RCL
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Re: Estonia - Scenery developement

Postby henrikp » Fri Mar 20, 2015 6:45 am

legoboyvdlp wrote in Thu Mar 19, 2015 11:45 pm:Nice! Beautiful. Good job!
Does the apt.dat include eddf 07LCR/25RCL

Sadly no, I have manually added those previous airports myself.
Get the package with the latest date from http://gateway.x-plane.com/scenery/page/EDDF, find the apt.dat from there and replace EDDF in $FG_ROOT/Airports/apt.dat.gz (you will have to unpack prior editing and repack it with gzip again) Lines starting with "I" and "99" mark the start and the end of the file, they can't reoccur in the middle of the file or you will have unexpected behaviour.
PS: Make a backup first, in case you mess up :)
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Re: Estonia - Scenery developement

Postby legoboyvdlp » Fri Mar 20, 2015 9:05 am

Thinking of the apt.dat on jomos site. Ok. I think I'll use his just in case if you don't mind.
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Re: Estonia - Scenery developement

Postby henrikp » Fri Mar 20, 2015 9:12 am

legoboyvdlp wrote in Fri Mar 20, 2015 9:05 am:Thinking of the apt.dat on jomos site. Ok. I think I'll use his just in case if you don't mind.

If he provides an apt.dat file himself, better to use that, then it will most certainly match the current FG scenery.
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Re: Estonia - Scenery developement

Postby Alral » Sat Mar 21, 2015 9:35 pm

One more addition I have just sent you to Ruhnu island. Might include that as well.

And I hope you don't mind I put all this things into the archive on my host as well? (All contributions will be mentioned, of course).
http://www.flightgear.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=9312

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Re: Estonia - Scenery developement

Postby henrikp » Sun Mar 22, 2015 6:48 am

Alral wrote in Sat Mar 21, 2015 9:35 pm:One more addition I have just sent you to Ruhnu island. Might include that as well.

And I hope you don't mind I put all this things into the archive on my host as well? (All contributions will be mentioned, of course).

Church added and package updated. Of course host them too, more coverage :)
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Re: Estonia - Scenery developement

Postby Alral » Sun Apr 12, 2015 11:53 pm

Image
Image
That ship you might have seen in Ruhnu harbour can now be sailed.
viewtopic.php?f=18&t=25984&p=238672#p238672

I hope in a week or two to make some more additions to Tallinn (and perhaps Kuressaare), and then make another release of the full version, which will include Henrik's addition to Ruhnu and Kuressaare as well.
http://www.flightgear.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=9312

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Re: Estonia - Scenery developement

Postby Alral » Sat Apr 18, 2015 9:36 pm

Maybe someone could enlighten me a little?
I am experimenting with newer housing type which employs less polygons - hence half the file size of the previous type, in favor of more extensive texture usage. In sake of simplicity (I make things in Sketchup) I keep the textures in different files. As I have replaced some of the old-model houses with the new ones, I notice a large FPS drop whenever I look in that direction. So the question is:

Is replacing polygons with textures causing the effect? And is there a way to counter it (eg, with making texturemap, though I am not sure if it is possible to do use just a part of the file for a pattern texture in Sketchup. Such things as windows would make not much trouble except for replacement job)?

I believed that texture usage instead of adding faces (like for windows) makes things less resource-demanding. Now it appears that it's not that simple. Or what could be the reason?

Image
http://www.flightgear.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=9312

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Re: Estonia - Scenery developement

Postby fmg » Sun Apr 19, 2015 8:49 am

Hi Alral,

hard to tell from afar. So I can only give some general advises and personal experience. But I guess you know most of it already.
How big is the texture file? When I working on textures I often have rather huge files (up to > 20 MB) before I reduce it to the final size. Once or twice I got a short slowdown while flying around in that scenery (Berlin). FG pauses about half a second and then goes on with normal frame rates. But since the scenery I work on is filled with models I can't figure out what is responsible for this. Also, for development, I often have some large texture files that has to be resized by FG in the scenery. So there are always some imperfect models around here. For the final texture file I downsize it, so it becomes less than 600 KB. If you have a lot of details in your texture the png-files size gets bigger. Never tested if this will have a influence too. I guess pixels will be pixels in the end, so that wouldn't make a difference finally.
After years of adding new stuff to the scenery my frame rate stays the same on my testbed start up position (30 fps with the UFO). So I continue. But of course the frame rate goes up if I look in a direction with less models. To figure out what is responsible for the huge frame rate drop in newer FG versions and with the 2.0 scenery I made test without models loaded. But that gave me only 2 fps more so I guess, the models couldn't be so bad.
Make sure, that your texture has the power of two. If not you would get a warning in the log-file that FG has to resize it.
Looks like you use alpha-channels in your texture file. I avoid this if possible and if not I make a small, separate texture where I put all the transparent stuff in. But I don't know anything about how this stuff get's computed in the code and if this will perform better than all in one big file. Unless I try to get as less texture files as possible for the model. If a texture has to be tilled I make a separate, small one.
I never used SkechUp, so I don' know it. But I can tell that ac-files that come from Blender gets smaller if I save them again in AC3D. Anyway the always become larger if you apply textures. Make sure that all possible faces are one-sided and flat shaded. Merge whatever you can to have as less objects as possible in the model file. If you have transparent objects in your model these should be the last in order. Erase all faces that you can't see.
But this can also depend on your hardware and system. I have a ATI Radeon HD 5870 with 1 GB VRAM here. Since the model don't looks so complex, a huge frame rate drop is somehow astounding.
Maybe you could do a test with lots of that model in the scenery, with and without a texture?

By the way: nice model. :wink:

Regards

f-)
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Re: Estonia - Scenery developement

Postby Catalanoic » Sun Apr 19, 2015 9:08 am

Totally agree. A tip is to use higher quality buildings that normally you see often, for example, airport infrastructure and nearby buildings, as well as some unique and important buildings. The rest don't need to be so good because there will be less likely to see and fewer people will see it. Also, great job!
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Re: Estonia - Scenery developement

Postby Alral » Sun Apr 19, 2015 2:45 pm

Well, the thing is: this is not a single-placed model, but a mass-production house. I mean, it is meant to be placed tens (hundreds, actually) of times (just the flat blocks of different types count about 200 for Tallinn at the moment, about 18 different types. Not speaking about 'unique' objects - these are a different story. Also huge lots of default shared-models). So one model might not be a problem, ten-twenty of this specific type - ....

Actually, it helped removing alpha-channel. At least no huge framerate drops as there used to be. Perhaps compressing textures will further help, but I'll see. Thanks for your replies :) .

The rest don't need to be so good because there will be less likely to see and fewer people will see it.

Well, the whole ideology of the project Estonia as I see it is to make the cities not just 'Place to land your plane while travelling from A to B", but equally a nice scenery for low-altitude flying, or even driving/sailing. So details are a must here. I am planning a 'light version' for those who experience trouble with the full version though - what will differ is just these mass-production houses which will be replaced by simpler models.

Image
Image
http://www.flightgear.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=9312

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