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OSM buidings EHLE

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Re: OSM buidings EHLE

Postby f-ojac » Wed Oct 23, 2013 5:40 am

Durk,
Concerning scenery, I'd say to avoid LFPO right now.
The alps are loverly, so you can have a lot of fun there. You can also go to Brittany (LFRB and surroundings).
Concerning aircrafts, apart of the award-winning 707, the dr400-dauphin is great with Rembrandt enabled, it has all bells and whistles, and the cap10b is also a lot of fun.
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Re: OSM buidings EHLE

Postby zakalawe » Wed Oct 23, 2013 11:12 am

Be aware we have modelled buildings from Julien for many locations in Asia, including VHHH and some bridges / skyscrapers. However there's no terminal at Kai-tek (realistic!) and the generic OSM skyscapers would be great, as well as the chequerboard and lead-in lights. (Really we should make these pieces conditional on the simulator date, since Kai-Tek is long closed - we do that for some other time-sensitivie landmarks). But yes with the scenery the approach looks fantastic, hopefully with the updated land-cover the water will be in the right place too.
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Re: OSM buidings EHLE

Postby radi » Wed Oct 23, 2013 11:49 am

Osm2city is smart enough to not place OSM buildings if there's a static one nearby. So if Julien's buildings are in terrasync, they should mix well.
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Re: OSM buidings EHLE

Postby zakalawe » Wed Oct 23, 2013 1:09 pm

radi wrote in Wed Oct 23, 2013 11:49 am:Osm2city is smart enough to not place OSM buildings if there's a static one nearby. So if Julien's buildings are in terrasync, they should mix well.

Ah fantastic, that sounds good indeed.

A thought occurs - this is much more blue-sky, could we run a C++ version of the script in real-time? As an alternative / replacement for random-buildings. This relies on two assumptions: that the input data per tile is sensible sized (tens of kbytes, or worst case a hundred for centre of really built up city), and that the script could run in 'almost real time' on the OSG Pager thread.

So we'd add the outline data as an additional file in each Objects/foo/foo/dir, and if this mode is enabled, look for the file and run the buildings creation script at that time.
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Re: OSM buidings EHLE

Postby durk » Wed Oct 23, 2013 1:33 pm

zakalawe wrote in Wed Oct 23, 2013 11:12 am:(Really we should make these pieces conditional on the simulator date, since Kai-Tek is long closed - we do that for some other time-sensitivie landmarks). But yes with the scenery the approach looks fantastic, hopefully with the updated land-cover the water will be in the right place too.


I had always assumed that Kai-Tak would no longer exsist in the FlightGear world, given that the real airport is long-since demolished, until I checked it out this morning. Kai-Tak is definitely on my list to check out tonight, for possible use at FSWeekend. The new terrain looks good, although I do have a feeling that there's an urban area in the bay, and uncomfortably close to the runway, that wasn't there yet when the old airport was still operational. Making Kai-Tak time sensitive would really be cool. It certainly fits my intention of demonstrating the 707, I'll see whether it's feasible to do a 707 landing there tonight. :-)

Cheers,
Durk
Last edited by durk on Wed Oct 23, 2013 3:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: OSM buidings EHLE

Postby radi » Wed Oct 23, 2013 2:00 pm

I like the idea of having this generated at run-time, and I'm quite sure a c++ version could be fast enough. Raw OSM input data is too big (50 MB for LOWI), but that a) includes *everything* and b) is xml.

But storing pre-processed data could be an option. A typical scene now easily contains 50k buildings. Reducing that to, say, 10k, should fit into well under 1MB. And of course I could modify the script to generate that outline data. Perhaps we can come up with a spec of the outline data at FSweekend.
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Re: OSM buidings EHLE

Postby f-ojac » Wed Oct 23, 2013 5:04 pm

Yes, please discuss about it @FSWeekend.
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Re: OSM buidings EHLE

Postby stuart » Wed Oct 23, 2013 9:34 pm

zakalawe wrote in Wed Oct 23, 2013 1:09 pm:A thought occurs - this is much more blue-sky, could we run a C++ version of the script in real-time? As an alternative / replacement for random-buildings. This relies on two assumptions: that the input data per tile is sensible sized (tens of kbytes, or worst case a hundred for centre of really built up city), and that the script could run in 'almost real time' on the OSG Pager thread.


Probably the best way to do this would be to separate the "random" from the "buildings" in the curent random buildings, and use the OSM data as an alternative data source for the latter.

However, before we do that I need to get the PageLOD working well enough that I can replace the (relatively) memory efficient instantiation approach with the original memory-heavy implementation of random buildings which allows better control over each individual building.

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Re: OSM buidings EHLE

Postby Michat » Wed Oct 23, 2013 11:58 pm

Be advise. We will have a massive participation this year.
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Re: OSM buidings EHLE

Postby Hooray » Thu Oct 24, 2013 5:56 pm

stuart wrote in Wed Oct 23, 2013 9:34 pm:Probably the best way to do this would be to separate the "random" from the "buildings" in the curent random buildings, and use the OSM data as an alternative data source for the latter.


I'd suggest to get in touch with TheTom or Zakalawe and use TheTom's cppbind framework (see simgear/nasal/cppbind) to expose the building generation hooks to scripting space, that would then allow arbitrary input data to be used.
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Re: OSM buidings EHLE

Postby pommesschranke » Sat Oct 26, 2013 9:14 am

I just ATCd at KORD and it is sad to see such a big airport without terminal buildings.
How about using generated OSM Buildings for all airports that dont have static models yet ?

I
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Re: OSM buidings EHLE

Postby radi » Sat Oct 26, 2013 11:53 am

already on my todo list^^
OSM buildings for LOWI, EDDC
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Re: OSM buidings EHLE

Postby Hooray » Sat Oct 26, 2013 12:18 pm

pommesschranke wrote:How about using generated OSM Buildings for all airports that dont have static models yet ?


In case you weren't aware of it, several years ago (well, over half a decade...), some FG contributors experimented with extracting airport building geometry from freely available airport terminal PDF charts to automatically create buildings with the right dimensions, and they made some quite promising progress back then, see the original svg2ac discussion here: http://www.mail-archive.com/flightgear- ... 01581.html


http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.games.f ... evel/34181
Julien is working on a program called svg2ac. The other day, we did an
experiment generating the Frankfurt airport out of an FAA's airport diagram
using this program.

http://flamebunny.homelinux.net/pics/EDDF.jpg

As you can see, there are still some bugs that need to be ironed out, and
Julien could use some help in this area. But once everything works properly,
buildings' size and placement would be accurate down to the meter.

This should cut down your work considerably, I would imagine. ;)


Right now svg2ac creates one .ac file containing all the buildings, another containing all the runways and a last one containing all the taxiways.
It would be easy for someone to go in the .ac file using either blender or AC3D and edit the geometry, to add features such as towers, modify the height of the buildings aor improve their shape.
Texturing could also be done, or colors can be added directly in the .ac file.
The output of svg2ac is not necessarily a finish product, it is a first step that indeed cuts down the developer's work when creating sceneries.
This code can also be used to create any kind of buildings from a vector image, such as city blocks or what have you.
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