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Buckaroo's Velocity XL-RG on 2019.1.1

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Buckaroo's Velocity XL-RG on 2019.1.1

Postby Zilesio » Mon Oct 07, 2019 11:38 am

Hi Everyone!

This is my first post on this forum :oops: !!

I'm totally in love with Buckaroo's Velocity XL,
but I have the impression the Author hasn't been active for a while;
both in the forum and with updating the plane...

and that's sad because his work is outstanding to say the least (also the Optica!).

That said, there's a few minor issues with flying his Velocity on 2019.1.1
Who knows, maybe someone may help?!?


1. The thermometer in the 3D cockpit is 1°C high compared to the 2D panel (which reports the correct temperature, I checked weather sites repetedly) - NOT really a big deal, but...

2. The COMM radios don't work (both 1 & 2): I can hear ATIS with the Cessna 172, but hear nothing in the XL - I think Gary (Buckaroo) clearly wrote somewhere that "the audio panel does little more than handle Marker Beacon sounds", or something, but still, there must be some way to re-route the ATIS audio message to the radio... is it hard to fix?

3. The Manifold Pressure reading on the EMD is "screwy" again, I think Gary had fixed this back in 2015, but on the 2018 & 2019 FG releases, the problem is back: it swings continuously 0-99 again and again.

4. The Altitude feature of the transponder, also, does not currently work... it shows FL 000 at whatever altitude you're at.

Proposals:

5. I assume Gary intended this bird to be simple/basic VFR fun-plane, but I think it would be marvellous if it could integrate the FG1000 in the empty space on the right side of the cockpit, in front of the copilot.
Even just for GPS/Map (leave the engine management to the EMD)

6. ...and maybe some simple LED's or some little logo on one of the displays to mark "AutoPilot ON (wing level - pitch hold)" or something...
I already use the FG built-in autopilot, but it's easy to forget what's ON and what's not after a while.

7. Last funny little thing: when opening the door from inside the cabin, the little ring around the door-lock button doesn't fly away with the rest of the fantastic gullwing-door... it stays floating in mid air!


I hope I haven't bored you readers with my pointless dreaming; also I understand this is a YASim model, and... maybe someone thinks this is not an "orthodox" FDM to care too much about?

... does anybody else care about this beautiful aircraft?

Looking forward for your opinions
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Re: Buckaroo's Velocity XL-RG on 2019.1.1

Postby Zilesio » Mon Oct 14, 2019 2:53 pm

Hi All!

Well, nobody joined the thread, I see, but... still... it got almost 100 views so far;
It means someone has been reading it!

Hopefully I can gather somebody else interested in this plane, so I thought I'd give it a few more tries.

The Velocity XL (specially the Retractable Gear version) is marvellous and it really deserves some attention.

Unfortunately, you will not find it in the main repository, but anybody can download this aircraft from the author's online hangar (just google "Velocity XL-RG Flightgear") or even the wiki page (then just unzip in "data/Aircraft" folder).

So, to recap:

Advantages - Looks beautiful thanks to its pusher/canard configuration, and it is quite fast at Vne 200 kts; very stable in flight; very coordinated as it hardly needs any rudder during light bank turns. Very efficient, if you cruise 20°F LOP (Lean Of Peak) you can go very far and get there very early.

Disadvantages - No flaps, the "double pedal" airbrake will only help a little, you really have to slow down early enough to enter pattern at 100 kts, or you'll miss approach. Also, as a consequence, it needs plenty of runway to stop.
As far as I know, most "specimens" in real life do not have Auto Pilot installed, can be tiring to fly long distances (So happy FG has a built in AP that works fine!!)

Now, the sim issues (mostly the radio stack) I listed above still remain, and I would like to fix them;

For example, COM radios can't be heard because of the KMA-24 Audio Panel sim currently mounted.
It only beeps at marker beacons, and apparently handles no other sounds.

...the Cessna 337 Skymaster (regularly in FG repository) has a different sim of the same KMA-24,
almost all buttons animated and works very well, so!
Does anybody think it would be possible to "copy/paste" this audio panel sim into the Velocity folder?
Would it work?

I am now looking for help within and outside FG forum, as personally I'm not much of a coder...

Would anybody like to help/join? let's try to give this plane a future!!
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Re: Buckaroo's Velocity XL-RG on 2019.1.1

Postby SurferTim » Mon Oct 14, 2019 4:18 pm

It is a good flying aircraft, but lacking a few features.
No autopilot. :(
No DME.
No ILS.

However, the VOR/localizer works.
The ADF works.

I am NOT FOND of the brake steering.
Fly low. Fly slow. Land on a dime. Twin Otter. https://github.com/SurferTim/dhc6p
My other aircraft is a Citation-X https://github.com/SurferTim/CitationX
PirateAir videos at https://www.youtube.com/user/SurferTim850
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Re: Buckaroo's Velocity XL-RG on 2019.1.1

Postby WoodSTokk » Mon Oct 14, 2019 4:22 pm

On Buckaroo's website is also a readme file http://www.buckarooshangar.com/flightgear/Avionics_readme.html.
Information about radio:
Buckaroo wrote:KMA 24 Audio Panel

Currently this doesn't do much. You can play with the knob, test the marker beacon lights, and toggle the marker beacon sound on/off.
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Re: Buckaroo's Velocity XL-RG on 2019.1.1

Postby Thorsten » Mon Oct 14, 2019 6:48 pm

Does anybody think it would be possible to "copy/paste" this audio panel sim into the Velocity folder?


Usually that kind of thing tends to work with instruments.

It's kind of hard to delve into someone else's plane (and I can't help at all with YaSim issues), but I think I should be able to take a look at some of these questions and give you a few pointers how to solve them.
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Re: Buckaroo's Velocity XL-RG on 2019.1.1

Postby wkitty42 » Mon Oct 14, 2019 9:21 pm

Zilesio wrote in Mon Oct 14, 2019 2:53 pm:(then just unzip in "data/Aircraft" folder).

don't do this! unzip it into your private custom craft directory instead... then ensure FG knows where that directory is and it'll find all the craft you put in there...

eg: ~/myflightgear/customcraft/Aircraft

point FG to that directory and off ya go without interfering with the default data tree... you do the same for custom scenery, too ;)
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"Why not?" said Gurder.
"Dunno. It's frightened of heights, I guess."
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Re: Buckaroo's Velocity XL-RG on 2019.1.1

Postby WoodSTokk » Tue Oct 15, 2019 1:15 am

@Zilesio:

Go into the directory 'Velocity-XL-RG/Systems' and open the file 'Velocity-XL-RG-instrumentation.xml' with a text editor.
Add the following lines after the '<PropertyList>' tag:
Code: Select all
  <comm-radio>
    <name>comm</name>
    <number>0</number>
  </comm-radio>

  <comm-radio>
    <name>comm</name>
    <number>1</number>
  </comm-radio>

This will load the comm radio systems and ATIS should work.
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Re: Buckaroo's Velocity XL-RG on 2019.1.1

Postby WoodSTokk » Tue Oct 15, 2019 1:58 am

SurferTim wrote in Mon Oct 14, 2019 4:18 pm:It is a good flying aircraft, but lacking a few features.
No autopilot. :(
No DME.
No ILS.

However, the VOR/localizer works.
The ADF works.

I am NOT FOND of the brake steering.


DME and LOC are working.
You must switch the DME on and set the frequency manually.
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Re: Buckaroo's Velocity XL-RG on 2019.1.1

Postby Zilesio » Tue Oct 15, 2019 12:32 pm

Fantastic!

My ego is flattered by such attention from the forum veterans!!
Thank you all very much for your replies :D

Ok, in reverse order:

WoodSTokk wrote in Tue Oct 15, 2019 1:58 am:
SurferTim wrote in Mon Oct 14, 2019 4:18 pm:It is a good flying aircraft, but lacking a few features.
No autopilot. :(
No DME.
No ILS.

However, the VOR/localizer works.
The ADF works.

I am NOT FOND of the brake steering.


DME and LOC are working.
You must switch the DME on and set the frequency manually.


You CAN set the frequency manually, but you don't have to: if you slide the top switch to the LEFT (mouse center button, or press mouse wheel) it will use the NAV1 frequency, works great!
Also, you can use the FG built-in Auto Pilot, I mapped the commands I need, off to some joystick buttons, no problem.

---

WoodSTokk wrote in Tue Oct 15, 2019 1:15 am:@Zilesio:

Go into the directory 'Velocity-XL-RG/Systems' and open the file 'Velocity-XL-RG-instrumentation.xml' with a text editor.
Add the following lines after the '<PropertyList>' tag:
Code: Select all
  <comm-radio>
    <name>comm</name>
    <number>0</number>
  </comm-radio>

  <comm-radio>
    <name>comm</name>
    <number>1</number>
  </comm-radio>

This will load the comm radio systems and ATIS should work.


I'M ON MY KNEES!!! I can't believe it, it works!!! How could I possibly thank you enough? You made my day!!
...was it really that easy?!? Man, I gotta study a bit :shock:

---

wkitty42 wrote in Mon Oct 14, 2019 9:21 pm:
Zilesio wrote in Mon Oct 14, 2019 2:53 pm:(then just unzip in "data/Aircraft" folder).

don't do this! unzip it into your private custom craft directory instead... then ensure FG knows where that directory is and it'll find all the craft you put in there...

eg: ~/myflightgear/customcraft/Aircraft

point FG to that directory and off ya go without interfering with the default data tree... you do the same for custom scenery, too ;)


Well... what should I do now, just move the Velocity folder to... where exactly?
And by the way, where are the planes I download from the main repository? where do they end up?
I was thinking I may go nosy-nosy into some xml files to see how their best features are scripted...

---

Thorsten wrote in Mon Oct 14, 2019 6:48 pm:
Does anybody think it would be possible to "copy/paste" this audio panel sim into the Velocity folder?


Usually that kind of thing tends to work with instruments.

It's kind of hard to delve into someone else's plane (and I can't help at all with YaSim issues), but I think I should be able to take a look at some of these questions and give you a few pointers how to solve them.


I'm already very happy with WoodSTokk's fix for the original KMA 24 by Buckaroo, but yes, actually, to be honest,
the one in the 337 Skymaster (other great plane!) is more detailed, with animated/lit up buttons and... I admit it would be a cool upgrade to the cabin
I hope I'll soon figure how to try this transplant.

---

Thanks again to everyone;
A sensible next step would be to figure out how to make the transponder show the Flight Level when the knob is on "Altitude"...
If I could get another good hint, I would be deeply thankful
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Re: Buckaroo's Velocity XL-RG on 2019.1.1

Postby WoodSTokk » Tue Oct 15, 2019 3:31 pm

Zilesio wrote in Tue Oct 15, 2019 12:32 pm:You CAN set the frequency manually, but you don't have to: if you slide the top switch to the LEFT (mouse center button, or press mouse wheel) it will use the NAV1 frequency, works great!

Oh! Nice! I have looked but not tested all switch positions. I stopped investigating as i found out that i can set the frequency.
But, yes, i wondered why there is this switch. Now i know it. Thanks.

Zilesio wrote in Tue Oct 15, 2019 12:32 pm:Also, you can use the FG built-in Auto Pilot, I mapped the commands I need, off to some joystick buttons, no problem.

I think the matter of lacking the autopilot has to do with the type of aircraft.
Many of this small crafts are only for short VFR flights and many of them havn't an autopilot.
As example the original Navion (from 1949) has also no autopilot.

Zilesio wrote in Tue Oct 15, 2019 12:32 pm:I'M ON MY KNEES!!! I can't believe it, it works!!! How could I possibly thank you enough? You made my day!!
...was it really that easy?!? Man, I gotta study a bit :shock:

Yes, it is so easy ;)
There was changes in FG radio code after the aircraft was made.
I dont know how that works in the past, because i'm using FG for 2 years and the changes was before this time.
But i found out, that some older aircrafts havn't defined the radios in the system section.
If you have a aircraft without working radios, look in the system section if the radios are defined.


Zilesio wrote in Mon Oct 14, 2019 2:53 pm:
wkitty42 wrote in Mon Oct 14, 2019 9:21 pm:don't do this! unzip it into your private custom craft directory instead... then ensure FG knows where that directory is and it'll find all the craft you put in there...

eg: ~/myflightgear/customcraft/Aircraft

point FG to that directory and off ya go without interfering with the default data tree... you do the same for custom scenery, too ;)


Well... what should I do now, just move the Velocity folder to... where exactly?
And by the way, where are the planes I download from the main repository? where do they end up?
I was thinking I may go nosy-nosy into some xml files to see how their best features are scripted...


FG creates a directory with a subtree for settings, scenery, aircrafts and so on.
I'm on Linux and FG created the directory '.fgfs' inside my home directory (full path is '/home/woodstokk/.fgfs').
If you download a aircraft from a hangar, FG creates directories and files inside the '.fgfs' directory.
As example, if i download the Navion, i will end up with '/home/woodstokk/.fgfs/Aircraft/org.flightgear.fgaddon.trunk/Aircraft/Ryan-Navion'
As you can see, inside the '.fgfs' directory is now the 'Aircraft' directory.
All directories/files inside the 'Aircraft' directory, are managed by FG! You can also see the hangar (as directory) where you downloaded the craft.
If you download a craft manually, you should put it in a dedicated directory.
As example, i have create a local directory for manually downloaded crafts.
Add this directory In the launcher as 'Additional aircraft folder' in the 'Add-ons' section.
The Velocity-XL-RG is located at '/home/woodstokk/.fgfs/Aircraft-local/Velocity-XL-RG' on my system and '/home/woodstokk/.fgfs/Aircraft-local' is declared as a additional aircraft folder.

The same goes on if you download and extract custom scenery. You should but it into a local scenery directory and define it as 'Additional scenery folder' in the 'Add-ons' section.

Zilesio wrote in Tue Oct 15, 2019 12:32 pm:Thanks again to everyone;
A sensible next step would be to figure out how to make the transponder show the Flight Level when the knob is on "Altitude"...
If I could get another good hint, I would be deeply thankful

The transponder is related to the same changes as the radios.
But the transponder has more updates received and so it is harder to accomplish.
I have repaired the transponder on some other aircrafts, so i know it is a bit difficult.
If i have enough spare time, i will look into it.
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Re: Buckaroo's Velocity XL-RG on 2019.1.1

Postby Thorsten » Tue Oct 15, 2019 6:07 pm

1. The thermometer in the 3D cockpit is 1°C high compared to the 2D panel (which reports the correct temperature, I checked weather sites repetedly) - NOT really a big deal, but...


Okay, let's get you started on that one as well.

In the file

/Aircraft/Velocity-XL/Models/Interior/Panel/Instruments/EGT-OAT/EGT-OAT.xml you'll find the section

Code: Select all
  <animation>
    <type>rotate</type>
    <object-name>PtrR</object-name>
    <property>environment/temperature-degc</property>
    <interpolation>
     <entry><ind> -20 </ind><dep>  0.0 </dep></entry>
     <entry><ind>   0 </ind><dep> 21.0 </dep></entry>
     <entry><ind>  20 </ind><dep> 47.0 </dep></entry>
     <entry><ind>  40 </ind><dep> 65.0 </dep></entry>
     <entry><ind>  60 </ind><dep> 76.5 </dep></entry>
    </interpolation>
    <center>
      <x-m> 0.00 </x-m>
      <y-m> 0.02 </y-m>
      <z-m> 0.00 </z-m> 
    </center>
    <axis>
     <x> -1 </x>
     <y>  0 </y>
     <z>  0 </z>
    </axis>
  </animation>


This defines the rotation of the outside air temperature indicator as a function of temperature - in particular the interpolation section defines how many degrees to move for what temperature. So at -20 degC the indicator moves 0 deg in angle, at 0 deg it moves 21 deg in angle and so on.

What you need to do is to modify the table such that it shows correct for all temperatures in range.
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Re: Buckaroo's Velocity XL-RG on 2019.1.1

Postby wkitty42 » Tue Oct 15, 2019 9:05 pm

Zilesio wrote in Mon Oct 14, 2019 2:53 pm:
wkitty42 wrote in Mon Oct 14, 2019 9:21 pm:don't do this! unzip it into your private custom craft directory instead... then ensure FG knows where that directory is and it'll find all the craft you put in there...

eg: ~/myflightgear/customcraft/Aircraft

point FG to that directory and off ya go without interfering with the default data tree... you do the same for custom scenery, too ;)


Well... what should I do now, just move the Velocity folder to... where exactly?

to a private directory you create specifically for the 3rd party hanger/custom craft you download...

in my example, i'm on linux... the home directory is represented by "~" (tilde)... in my home directory i created a directory called "myflightgear"... this directory holds all my custom stuff... scenery, craft, overrides, etc... for the custom/3rd party craft i download, i created "customcraft" inside "myflightgear"... inside there is an "Aircraft" directory where i put the actual craft directories just like FG does... in the launcher, in addons, i added the myflightgear/customcraft/Aircraft directory to the list of directories to look in for aircraft...

Zilesio wrote in Tue Oct 15, 2019 12:32 pm:And by the way, where are the planes I download from the main repository? where do they end up?

using my linux setup again, since it is the only one i know, craft downloaded in the launcher are placed in "~./fgfs/Aircraft/org.flightgear.fgaddon" or "~./fgfs/Aircraft/org.flightgear.fgaddon.trunk" depending on which hanger list they are downloaded from... since i already have all of fgaddon downloaded and maintained outside of FG, i don't use them... on winwhatever, they are found in the FG folder in %appdata% using the same basic path format...

Zilesio wrote in Tue Oct 15, 2019 12:32 pm:I was thinking I may go nosy-nosy into some xml files to see how their best features are scripted...

generally speaking, that's a GoodIdea<tm>... it is how i became as familiar with FG as i am and i'm still learning a lot about this 20year-old project every day :)
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"Why not?" said Gurder.
"Dunno. It's frightened of heights, I guess."
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Re: Buckaroo's Velocity XL-RG on 2019.1.1

Postby Zilesio » Thu Oct 17, 2019 2:22 pm

wkitty42 wrote in Tue Oct 15, 2019 9:05 pm:
Zilesio wrote in Mon Oct 14, 2019 2:53 pm:Well... what should I do now, just move the Velocity folder to... where exactly?

to a private directory you create specifically for the 3rd party hanger/custom craft you download...

in my example, i'm on linux... the home directory is represented by "~" (tilde)... in my home directory i created a directory called "myflightgear"... this directory holds all my custom stuff... scenery, craft, overrides, etc... for the custom/3rd party craft i download, i created "customcraft" inside "myflightgear"... inside there is an "Aircraft" directory where i put the actual craft directories just like FG does... in the launcher, in addons, i added the myflightgear/customcraft/Aircraft directory to the list of directories to look in for aircraft...



&

WoodSTokk wrote in Tue Oct 15, 2019 3:31 pm:
Zilesio wrote in Mon Oct 14, 2019 2:53 pm:Well... what should I do now, just move the Velocity folder to... where exactly?
And by the way, where are the planes I download from the main repository? where do they end up?
I was thinking I may go nosy-nosy into some xml files to see how their best features are scripted...


FG creates a directory with a subtree for settings, scenery, aircrafts and so on.
I'm on Linux and FG created the directory '.fgfs' inside my home directory (full path is '/home/woodstokk/.fgfs').
If you download a aircraft from a hangar, FG creates directories and files inside the '.fgfs' directory.
As example, if i download the Navion, i will end up with '/home/woodstokk/.fgfs/Aircraft/org.flightgear.fgaddon.trunk/Aircraft/Ryan-Navion'
As you can see, inside the '.fgfs' directory is now the 'Aircraft' directory.
All directories/files inside the 'Aircraft' directory, are managed by FG! You can also see the hangar (as directory) where you downloaded the craft.
If you download a craft manually, you should put it in a dedicated directory.
As example, i have create a local directory for manually downloaded crafts.
Add this directory In the launcher as 'Additional aircraft folder' in the 'Add-ons' section.
The Velocity-XL-RG is located at '/home/woodstokk/.fgfs/Aircraft-local/Velocity-XL-RG' on my system and '/home/woodstokk/.fgfs/Aircraft-local' is declared as a additional aircraft folder.

The same goes on if you download and extract custom scenery. You should but it into a local scenery directory and define it as 'Additional scenery folder' in the 'Add-ons' section.


I just realised that planes downloaded from the main menu accessible "official" repository, well... on winwhatever at least, are saved in Documents/Flightgear/Aircraft and not directly inside the FG installation (C:/Programs/Flightgear2019/Data/Aircraft) surprise!!

So... small question, you both prompt me to create a separate directory (i.e. folder, right?) for 3d party hanger sourced planes but... what if I just cut/paste the Velocity folder into that "Documents/Flightgear/Aircraft" folder together with, say, my "Cessna337", "Shuttle", and the rest I got from the maiin repository?
What should be wrong with that? :roll:

and then,
WoodSTokk wrote in Tue Oct 15, 2019 3:31 pm:
Zilesio wrote in Tue Oct 15, 2019 12:32 pm:Thanks again to everyone;
A sensible next step would be to figure out how to make the transponder show the Flight Level when the knob is on "Altitude"...
If I could get another good hint, I would be deeply thankful

The transponder is related to the same changes as the radios.
But the transponder has more updates received and so it is harder to accomplish.
I have repaired the transponder on some other aircrafts, so i know it is a bit difficult.
If i have enough spare time, i will look into it.


I found this inside the Velocity-XL-RG-instrumentation.xml file:

Code: Select all
 <transponder>
   <name>transponder</name>
   <number>0</number>
   <mode-c-altitude>/instrumentation/encoder/mode-c-alt-ft</mode-c-altitude>
 </transponder>


... I assume it means the "altitude" feature in the transponder is defined... right?
So, technically speaking it should show a FL when up in the air?!?
Or maybe the script syntax is out of date?

Thanks for bearing my endless questioning :D

---

Last but not least:

Thorsten wrote in Tue Oct 15, 2019 6:07 pm:
1. The thermometer in the 3D cockpit is 1°C high compared to the 2D panel (which reports the correct temperature, I checked weather sites repetedly) - NOT really a big deal, but...


Okay, let's get you started on that one as well.

In the file

/Aircraft/Velocity-XL/Models/Interior/Panel/Instruments/EGT-OAT/EGT-OAT.xml you'll find the section

Code: Select all
  <animation>
    <type>rotate</type>
    <object-name>PtrR</object-name>
    <property>environment/temperature-degc</property>
    <interpolation>
     <entry><ind> -20 </ind><dep>  0.0 </dep></entry>
     <entry><ind>   0 </ind><dep> 21.0 </dep></entry>
     <entry><ind>  20 </ind><dep> 47.0 </dep></entry>
     <entry><ind>  40 </ind><dep> 65.0 </dep></entry>
     <entry><ind>  60 </ind><dep> 76.5 </dep></entry>
    </interpolation>
    <center>
      <x-m> 0.00 </x-m>
      <y-m> 0.02 </y-m>
      <z-m> 0.00 </z-m> 
    </center>
    <axis>
     <x> -1 </x>
     <y>  0 </y>
     <z>  0 </z>
    </axis>
  </animation>


This defines the rotation of the outside air temperature indicator as a function of temperature - in particular the interpolation section defines how many degrees to move for what temperature. So at -20 degC the indicator moves 0 deg in angle, at 0 deg it moves 21 deg in angle and so on.

What you need to do is to modify the table such that it shows correct for all temperatures in range.


Precious insight but I'm not sure I understand the details... I mean, the thermometer in the 3d cockpit is digital, not analog, so there is no hand roating amounts of degrees... :?
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Re: Buckaroo's Velocity XL-RG on 2019.1.1

Postby Thorsten » Thu Oct 17, 2019 3:15 pm

I only saw the EGT/OAT (where the latter presumably means 'outside air temperature') instrument, and I assure you that this isn't digital.
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Re: Buckaroo's Velocity XL-RG on 2019.1.1

Postby enrogue » Thu Oct 17, 2019 4:11 pm

On the Velocity XL RG downloaded from Buckaroos hangar I see a digital OAT to the right of the radio controls & above the ammeter, it has a single button which switches between F, C & Voltage

Its configuration is in Models/Instruments/oat_m303.xml, and if you look you can see it takes it's readings from /environment/temperature-degc & /environment/temperature-degf (temp in C & F respectively)

Checking those vs what is shown on the display I see no discrepancy in the display - it might be rounding down though (tested with next & 2019.1.2)
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