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Douglas DC-3 C47 - Dual Control

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Re: Douglas DC-3 C47 - Dual Control

Postby i4dnf » Mon Oct 03, 2011 7:31 pm

Unfortunately for the lightcones it doesn't work that way. Because of the stencil operation they multiply whatever colour you have in the lightcone with the object's colour, which happens to be very close to black at night because of the multiplication with ambient light. (Ambient light is set very low, it shouldn't be 0 anyway, and when you multiply with 0 anyone knows what happens) That's why their intensity is dependant on time of day too. And the target object's colour cannot be affected, the effect/shader only knows what happens on the current object.
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Re: Douglas DC-3 C47 - Dual Control

Postby Thorsten » Tue Oct 04, 2011 6:32 am

Because of the stencil operation they multiply whatever colour you have in the lightcone with the object's colour, which happens to be very close to black at night because of the multiplication with ambient light.


Well, as long as you have gl_LightSource around you can take its norm to determine the multiplier (the lightcone color) for the object color, and the net result should then be independent of ambient light, no?
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Re: Douglas DC-3 C47 - Dual Control

Postby i4dnf » Tue Oct 04, 2011 8:09 am

Not quite. You have control over the source object (the lightcone), you can do whatever you want with it, but you have no direct control over the destination objects (runway, terrrain, buildings etc). You can do whatever you want with the lightcone itself, but in the end it will get multiplied with 0 at night.
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Re: Douglas DC-3 C47 - Dual Control

Postby Thorsten » Tue Oct 04, 2011 9:03 am

You can do whatever you want with the lightcone itself, but in the end it will get multiplied with 0 at night.


Agreed, if the terrain you want to illuminate has exactly (0,0,0) as color vector, then this doesn't work. If it's (0.00001, 0.000002, 0.00000008) then it does. But is it really zero? And if so, should it, or should we not rather make the core insert a small value at all times (stars, stray light, moon,...).
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Re: Douglas DC-3 C47 - Dual Control

Postby i4dnf » Tue Oct 04, 2011 9:38 am

It is very, very, very low. I've done some tests with a hardcoded value in a shader, and 0.005 ~ 0.01 as a lower limit would suffice, and would be more realistic than it currently is.
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Re: Douglas DC-3 C47 - Dual Control

Postby Thorsten » Tue Oct 04, 2011 9:55 am

Not sure if we are talking the same issue - it shouldn't matter if it's very small as long as its non-zero.

Suppose a pixel is blue in the texture, so it might be (0,0,0.9). We illuminate this with a very weak ambient light source of (0.001, 0.001, 0.001). This should probably transform the pixel to (0,0,0.0009) which is, for all practical purposes, black.

Now, if I create a secondary light source, i.e. my cone which is defined by (c1, c2, c4) where c1 = 1/ambient.r, c2 = 1/ambient.g, c3 = 1/ambient.b, i.e. (1000, 1000, 1000) - that's an intense white. That transforms my pixel to (0,0, 0.9), i.e. the pixel goes back to where it was unless it really was (0,0,0) and not (0,0,almost 0).

If I define the cone by a * (c1, c2, c3) then I can even dim the result by any factor a I want. Why wouldn't this work?
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Re: Douglas DC-3 C47 - Dual Control

Postby i4dnf » Tue Oct 04, 2011 10:43 am

Because on the target object, let's say the runway, everything in gets clamped first to (0.0, 1.0), as per the default shader (or any other shader), before being multiplied with the ambient, and mixed with the fog to get the final colour.

Again, I repeat , you cannot control what happens on the target object from the lightcone shader. You can control that from the respective shader active on the target object, but that's just a bad thing(tm), hardcoding localy values that should be global and checked and dealt with in the core.

What you're talking about is a light, this however is not a light, it's a clever trick that used to work.
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Re: Douglas DC-3 C47 - Dual Control

Postby Thorsten » Tue Oct 04, 2011 11:32 am

Again, I repeat , you cannot control what happens on the target object from the lightcone shader.(...)What you're talking about is a light, this however is not a light, it's a clever trick that used to work.


Apparently what you can do is 'multiply whatever colour you have in the lightcone with the object's colour'. Now if my lightcone has color (1000, 1000, 1000) (and this *must* accept values > 1 in order to see any enhancement at all), then my argument above applies.

It seems currently you can multiply the existing light with a constant, hard-coded value - which is why you get the daytime modulation of ambient light. The question is - can you multiply it with something else that is not a hard-coded number - a property, a run-time determined constant, ... if so, you can make that so such that the cone always shines with constant intensity. That's a mathematical truth (a multiplication group structure has an inverese element). I don't need to control the target object for that - I just choose a suitable color for the lightcone.
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Re: Douglas DC-3 C47 - Dual Control

Postby F-JJTH » Tue Oct 04, 2011 2:27 pm

Hi,

@El Fauta: I understand what you explain about the cone light ;) I think this is question of tast isn't it ? I have planned to create a GUI for DC-3, maybe I'll add your proposition to it. Thanks for your proposition ;)

Currently I work on the fuel system and hydraulic system.

Cheers,
Clément
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Re: Douglas DC-3 C47 - Dual Control

Postby Thorsten » Wed Oct 05, 2011 7:14 am

Let me just add that after test-flying the DC-3, I think you did really a great job with the model!
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Re: Douglas DC-3 C47 - Dual Control

Postby F-JJTH » Thu Oct 27, 2011 11:11 pm

Hi everybody,

I'm glad to tell you a new release of the Douglas DC-3 C47 !
In this new release :

- 2 new tutorials French / English (Presentation, Startup)
- hydraulic system (cowl flaps, flaps, landing gear, brake)
- wipers system
- Dual Control improvment (every switch can be controlled by pilot and copilot, )
- new livery (up to 34 liveries)
- new GUI for option (select texture quality, select interior variant, immatriculation, autostart, show yoke, show pilot...)
- new sound (under test, if you can help about sound your help is welcome !)
- interior texture improvment
- interior model improvment
- electrical system improvment
- fuel system
- realistic start procedure (select fuel tank, boost pump ON (fuel pressure increase), magneto BOTH, starter switch ON then OFF
- ... and many other little things ;)

Your suggestion are welcome ! I hope you like this work.
Download here : http://equipe-flightgear.forumactif.com ... -de-la-paf

In the TODOLIST :
- details selector
- landing light cone selector (El Fauta ;) )
- bug about cargo doors
- other tutorial
- autopilot improvment (currently we don't know exactly how it work)
- light indicator on panel (landing gear, oil pressure...)
- bug about landing gear and the new hydraulic system on Reset

Remember that you can fly with many people in this DC-3 C47 you can have 4 passenger (dc-3-psg1, dc-3-psg2, dc-3-psg3, dc-3-psg4) and 1 copilot (dc-3-copilot). The copilot can really help you in every sequence (start engine, landing gear manipulation, flaps manipulation, cowl flaps manipulation...)

In order to launch paratroopers you need to open the cargo doors then put ON the switch "Paratroopers signal" on the left of the overhead.

Image

Image

Image

Image


Cheers,
Clément
Last edited by F-JJTH on Sun Jan 15, 2012 5:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Douglas DC-3 C47 - Dual Control

Postby Marschi » Fri Oct 28, 2011 5:43 am

That looks absolutely fantastic! :shock:

Little time at the moment, but I'm looking forward to fly this beautiful airplane :)

Thank you!
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Re: Douglas DC-3 C47 - Dual Control

Postby durk » Mon Oct 31, 2011 12:22 pm

F-JJTH wrote in Thu Oct 27, 2011 11:11 pm:- bug about landing gear and the new hydraulic system on Reset


Just a quick question: I've been having a few problems that caused to to use the reset function, and now the gear appears to be stuck in the downward position (even after restarting flightgear). Is there something I can do to fix this?

Other than that, this is a really well done aircraft, and I'm looking forward to many hours of demonstrating this at FSWeekend.

cheers,
Durk
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Re: Douglas DC-3 C47 - Dual Control

Postby F-JJTH » Mon Oct 31, 2011 1:52 pm

Hi durk,

It's very stange, do you use g/G on your keyboard in order to handle the gear ?
Try to Reset 2 times.

Cheers,
Clément
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Re: Douglas DC-3 C47 - Dual Control

Postby durk » Mon Oct 31, 2011 2:13 pm

Hi Clément,

I'm using the gear up/down button on my joystick. I'll try to use the g/G later and see if that makes a difference. I'll report back later.

Cheers,
Durk
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