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Floating Planes in Multiplayer

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Floating Planes in Multiplayer

Postby Kafovofa » Wed Jul 10, 2019 5:30 am

Whether I use detailed multiplayer models or not, and whether I have AI disabled or not, most other player models appear 10 feet off the ground. Is there a way I can fix this?

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Re: Floating Planes in Multiplayer

Postby Thorsten » Wed Jul 10, 2019 5:45 am

Well, they are airplanes... :D
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Re: Floating Planes in Multiplayer

Postby Kafovofa » Wed Jul 10, 2019 5:58 am

Lol, but I don't think 777s or 737s hover like spaceships.
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Re: Floating Planes in Multiplayer

Postby legoboyvdlp » Wed Jul 10, 2019 8:27 am

What scenery are you using- TerraSync or is it downloaded from flightgear.org?
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Re: Floating Planes in Multiplayer

Postby V12 » Wed Jul 10, 2019 4:14 pm

This is common problem when Your and other MP pilots scenery is from different sources. Your scenery is for example 100 feets above sea level, but MP pilot has another version of that scenery with airport elevation 110 feets above sea level.
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Re: Floating Planes in Multiplayer

Postby Kafovofa » Thu Jul 11, 2019 1:04 am

Ah, good to know.
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Re: Floating Planes in Multiplayer

Postby jomo » Mon Nov 11, 2019 11:00 am

V12 wrote in Wed Jul 10, 2019 4:14 pm:This is common problem when Your and other MP pilots scenery is from different sources. Your scenery is for example 100 feets above sea level, but MP pilot has another version of that scenery with airport elevation 110 feets above sea level.

Well sounds interesting - but there must be more!
That was working OK prior to that OpenRadar problems some time ago - and the latest MP-changes.

If you look my movies (e.g. http://www.emmerich-j.de/EDDF/Films/201 ... 853-87.mp4, starting at film-minute 20) you will see the new problems:
1) planes on final will show
* a wrong model if some way out (e.g. the white AirFrance livery - never used by AAL4955)
* then the true silvery AA-model
2) During taxiing I tried zooming in out and you see that change happens again and again - and in addition the model is on GND or some feet above. (Without changing the scenery in-between!!)
3) Also pilots tell me that they notice a change in altitude shortly before touchdown (thus that happens just withion the pilot-model. (Without changing the scenery in-between!!)

With other models even some other conditions change - e.g.
* height over GND
* livery
* gear position
* etc etc
i.e. it looks like a different model or out of a different model-library!

BTW: I am using for OpenRadar and OrCam the newest FGFS +MP + https://github.com/FGMEMBERS-TERRAGIT/terraGIT ! I prefer that scenery because it has a lot more scenery-details!

But that cannot explain that big differences seen by different people watching the same object - I would expect via MULTY-PLAY everyboddy gets the same data about a unique target)! Obviously that data come via MP - by which I have no idea how MP gathers those data! I would have expected they take those data out of the "internal-properties/sim" of the target ! But seems I may be wrong

Anybody has an idea how to fix that?
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Re: Floating Planes in Multiplayer

Postby tdammers » Mon Nov 11, 2019 11:34 am

jomo wrote in Mon Nov 11, 2019 11:00 am:But that cannot explain that big differences seen by different people watching the same object - I would expect via MULTY-PLAY everyboddy gets the same data about a unique target)! Obviously that data come via MP - by which I have no idea how MP gathers those data! I would have expected they take those data out of the "internal-properties/sim" of the target ! But seems I may be wrong
Anybody has an idea how to fix that?


This is actually completely logical. The MP protocol sends each aircraft model's position above mean sea level, and that's where it's placed on the other end. But if both ends (the other pilot and you, for example) don't use the same scenery, then the ground elevation might be different on either end. So suppose pilot A is sitting on the ground, using a scenery that has the ground elevation in that location at 100ft AMSL; but pilot B uses a scenery that has a ground elevation of 90ft AMSL in the same location. Now when pilot B looks at pilot A's model on their local machine, they will see the aircraft float, because pilot A's FG placed it at ground level, which, on their machine, is 100 ft AMSL, not 90, but pilot B's computer renders the ground at 90 ft AMSL. Makes sense?
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Re: Floating Planes in Multiplayer

Postby wkitty42 » Mon Nov 11, 2019 4:18 pm

jomo wrote in Mon Nov 11, 2019 11:00 am:If you look my movies (e.g. http://www.emmerich-j.de/EDDF/Films/201 ... 853-87.mp4, starting at film-minute 20) you will see the new problems:
1) planes on final will show
* a wrong model if some way out (e.g. the white AirFrance livery - never used by AAL4955)
* then the true silvery AA-model

this appears to be related to the LOD system and its use of AI or craft provided fallback models...

1. what are your LOD settings for AI craft?
2. do the craft in question have a fallback model defined?
"You get more air close to the ground," said Angalo. "I read that in a book. You get lots of air low down, and not much when you go up."
"Why not?" said Gurder.
"Dunno. It's frightened of heights, I guess."
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Re: Floating Planes in Multiplayer

Postby legoboyvdlp » Mon Nov 11, 2019 5:12 pm

Exactly - good to know the system is working nicely!

a wrong model if some way out (e.g. the white AirFrance livery - never used by AAL4955)


It's showing the fallback model, you can change that behaviour if you want, its not a wrong model... ;)

Looks to me like the fallback model is being placed however about 10 feet off the ground.
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Re: Floating Planes in Multiplayer

Postby jomo » Tue Nov 12, 2019 9:43 am

Hi tdammers + wikitty42 + legoboyvdlp
thanks a million for your support.
I guess with your hints I did find the problem: In the latest FGFS-Releases the default ranges for Aircraft-LOD-settings have changed from old detailed 3000/10000 to new 300/xxxx! For now I have set them to "High Detail only" and will test it during my ATCing tomorrow!

Does anybody know for sure if that just affects the workload on the local PC or also the MP-workload? (I do not want to be killed by by the MP-designers!!)

A little more background info: I do that ATCing with filming since about 2 years - and many people seem to like it. But that means:
    1) I studied the LOD settings once (about 20 years ago) - but after that never touched them any more and thus did not notice the change in the defaults! I am not sure why they were changed - and I would worry if it was because of the MP-overload-problems.

    2) I really cannot influence the fallback-model of my many daily visitors - so that cannot really help me (I guess)

    3) Also the different Problems with the GND Altitudes I do not understand: While I watch my visitors neither they nor me do change the scenery during approach - I just change the viewing-zoom - and then the viewed, external model jumps up and down and gets form model-view to blue/yellow etc.!! i.e. it seems to depend on the LOD ranges. Thus by changing from "default" to "always" that should be solved (for me!!) -- but I do not understand why that happens to "default"-users!
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Re: Floating Planes in Multiplayer

Postby wkitty42 » Tue Nov 12, 2019 10:21 am

1. the LOD changes were not done for MP reasons... they apply to non-MP using AI craft as well...

2. no, you cannot influence the fallback model... that's up to the craft maintainers... this because some want to create/maintain a low-poly version of their craft that has some animations while others don't care and are OK with using a generic low-poly model that has no animations at all...

3. that's easy... the models have different origin points... one might have the origin at the nose of the craft, another may be at the center of the fuselage, a 3rd might be at the base of the main gear...

4. the thing about the models switching when you zoom is because the LOD is affected by the apparent distance... zooming in doesn't actually do only that... it moves the camera closer and the distance from the camera is what is used in LOD calcs...
"You get more air close to the ground," said Angalo. "I read that in a book. You get lots of air low down, and not much when you go up."
"Why not?" said Gurder.
"Dunno. It's frightened of heights, I guess."
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