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New desktop PC

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New desktop PC

Postby PH-RVL » Tue Sep 13, 2022 6:47 am

Hello All,

I am looking to purchase a new desktop pc soon.
I would like to know what to look for, such as memory,processor (Intel or AMD), video card(maybe buy these at a later date).
The budget is around 700 Euro.

Kind regards,

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Re: New desktop PC

Postby erik » Tue Sep 13, 2022 7:37 am

Every fairly modern system will do these days. I do advice 8Gb memeory as a bare minimum, everything more is bonus.

For video I would recommend to read this thread:
viewtopic.php?f=24&t=40706

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Re: New desktop PC

Postby Isaak » Tue Sep 13, 2022 7:50 am

I'd build one myself, and don't hesitate to buy some second hand components via a secure platform of your choice. Building your own pc seems huge when you're first doing it, but it's really plug and play these days.
- First choose your processor, FlightGear doesn't need the most recent generation of CPU's. Single core performance is still vital at the moment. I prefer Intel CPU's, an i7 with 4GHz or more single core performance can be purchased for about 300 euros. I recommend buying a new one, because they are fragile and easily damaged.
- 2nd buy a motherboard with the correct socket for the CPU, I'd buy a new one too, as this too is very easily damaged. Normally you'd choose a motherboard with an ATX form factor, to have the required slots to install a GPU. You're looking at something in the 100-150 euro ranges.
- A descent Nvidia graphics card (GPU) of an older generation can be purchased relatively cheap. The last digits of the GPU are more important for FlightGear than the first digits, an older GTX1080(Ti) will perform better than a new (and more expensive) RTX3040. This is the case for FlightGear in its current form, if you plan on playing other recent and demanding games, going the RTX-route can be viable. You can definitely find good deals on older graphics cards in 2nd hand, e.g. the GTX1080Ti can be found for as low as 200 euros if you take your time to find it. Also, choosing such a card gives you less risk on buying a GPU that has been used intensively for crypto mining (which puts a lot of stress on those cards), as they've become too slow to be used for that in recent years. Make sure that you pick up the card yourself and let the seller show that it functions on his/her system before you transfer any money. (Alas I've been the victim of a defective card in the past). I advise against buying an AMD graphics card for FlightGear as I've had issues with them myself in the past. I don't know if these issues have been resolved.
- Choose memory that matches your motherboard (DDR4 is standard these days), I recommend 16 GB of RAM on a modern system. This can be found 2nd hand, but as always: let the seller show that it works.
- Seek for a pc case that matches the form factor of the motherboard and has enough space for the GPU you chose. A pc-case can be bought really cheap 2nd hand. It's only interesting to invest many €'s in a case if you have spare money (which you don't for a gaming rig), as it's only window dressing.
- Buy a Power Supply Unit (PSU) that provides enough watt's to drive your CPU and GPU, you can find their required wattages easily online. Take some margin (in case you 'd want to improve your system later on) and buy a PSU that provides 100 or 200 Watts more than required. Even more is good, but will drive up the price. (If you're new into power sources: the demand of the CPU/GPU (and other components, but these are trivial) defines how much Watts a PSU must have, so buying a PSU with more watts than required is good, but a PSU that provides not enough Watts will malfunction).
- I guess you have already a mouse, keyboard and screen available. If not: they can be bought very cheap online/2nd hand.

This gives the following result:
- CPU: €250-350
- Motherboard: €100-150
- GPU: €200-250 (2nd hand - let the seller show that it works!)
- PSU: €50-150 (2nd hand - let the seller show that it works!)
- Memory: €50-€150 (2nd hand is possible)
- Mouse/keyboard combo: €25-50 (2nd hand)
- Screen: €25-50 (2nd hand)

Best case scenario this gives you a €700 pc, worst case you're looking at €1150. Take your time to choose what you really need and find it for a good price. You'll be able to build a much stronger pc for less money this way. Feel free to ask for help if you need any.
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Re: New desktop PC

Postby PH-RVL » Fri Sep 23, 2022 6:06 pm

Hello Isaac,

Thank you for the detailed explanation.
I think I will still go for a system which is put together and also put together by a company.
700 Euro is just a bit too much for me to experiment with.
Now I am figuring out the components, but still think I will go to a video card in the future, like an RTX.
There are also other simulators I am interested in, but the next version of flightgear, probably won't be able to run on old computers anymore I read.

Greetings Robert
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Re: New desktop PC

Postby MariuszXC » Fri Sep 23, 2022 9:16 pm

Isaak wrote in Tue Sep 13, 2022 7:50 am:- Seek for a pc case that matches the form factor of the motherboard and has enough space for the GPU you chose. A pc-case can be bought really cheap 2nd hand. It's only interesting to invest many €'s in a case if you have spare money (which you don't for a gaming rig), as it's only window dressing.


I agree with most points you made, but I think it is worth adding, that a bad choice of a pc-case has potential to severely impact cooling, so there is also this factor to consider. Basically, unrestricted airflow is important.
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Re: New desktop PC

Postby V12 » Sat Sep 24, 2022 5:55 am

PH-RVL wrote in Fri Sep 23, 2022 6:06 pm:700 Euro is just a bit too much for me to experiment with.

Flightsims are very resource hungry, for nice experience You need really powerful machine.
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Re: New desktop PC

Postby Isaak » Sat Sep 24, 2022 6:24 am

MariuszXC wrote in Fri Sep 23, 2022 9:16 pm:I agree with most points you made, but I think it is worth adding, that a bad choice of a pc-case has potential to severely impact cooling, so there is also this factor to consider. Basically, unrestricted airflow is important.


You're right. I had fancy transparant cases in mind when I wrote this. Cooling is vital. This reminds me that I forgot a cpu cooler in my list. I went the water cooling way in the past, but I've found that a descent air cooler can perform just as well, is generally cheaper and requires less maintenance than a water cooler.
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Re: New desktop PC

Postby PH-RVL » Wed Sep 28, 2022 7:24 pm

Hello all,

I have been googling for a while for a new system.
On this configuration I came out, well over 700 Euro, but yes that's once in these times.
What do you guys think of this configuration?

Computercase: Sharkoon VS-4 (no mini tower)
Powersupply: 750W CoolerMaster
Motherboard: B560M Gigabyte max. 128GB 1xDVI 1xHDMI 1xDisplayPort HD-audio 6xUSB
Processor: Intel Core i5 10600 6x 3.3GHZ
Cooling: Standard
Memory: 16GB DDR4 2666
Videocard: NVIDIA GeForce GTX1660 6GB Super
SSD: 1000GB

I know you can make it as crazy as you want, but I think this is something nice for my budget
And it will always be better than what I am working with now.

Processor: Pentium(R) Dual-Core CPU E6500 @ 2.93GHz × 2
Memory: 4 Gb
Videocard: Nvidia GT550 or GT650?? 512 Mb :oops:

Regards,

Robert PH-RVL
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Re: New desktop PC

Postby MariuszXC » Thu Sep 29, 2022 9:00 am

I think that B560 chipset supports memory speeds up to 2133MHz, so you will not take full advantage of 2666MHz RAM. A possible option to consider in this case is to go for 2133 RAM with lower latency. 16GB will be plenty for most tasks, but keep some slots empty for future needs ;)

6GB VRAM should be enough for most sceneries. Sure, the more the better, but a good compromise imo.
Same with CPU. Going for 10600K would get you marginal performance gain.

The chosen case seems to have fully solid front ( https://www.x-kom.pl/p/724832-obudowa-d ... black.html ). Not a good design for air flow. I would reconsider and try to find something with mesh front and possibly an exhaust also at the top.
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Re: New desktop PC

Postby PH-RVL » Sun Oct 16, 2022 7:16 pm

Hello All,

I still come back to the type of processor.
I'll throw it into discussion anyway.

Intel or AMD?

Greatz,

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Re: New desktop PC

Postby V12 » Sun Oct 16, 2022 9:14 pm

MariuszXC wrote in Thu Sep 29, 2022 9:00 am:I 16GB will be plenty for most tasks

Bad idea for FG. 3 years ago, when I used FG I had setup with bare LOD 270 km, visibility limit 250 km, When I flew from EGLL to LIRF, somewhere over the Alps I had memory usage more than 16GB. And of course without OSM stuff. So I very recommend 32 GB. Othervise, You will need set bare LOD to not more than 120 km and visibility limit around 100 km. If You want use only C172, then 50 km bare LOD, 40 km visibility limit and 8 GB is enough. For airliners at FL390 You really need bunch of RAM.
And about VRAM - 2 GB is enough, I used old GTX 750 with 2 GB without any trouble even on flight at FL530 over content rich Europe and Alps. It was enough for example for this image :

Image
Last edited by V12 on Mon Oct 17, 2022 2:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New desktop PC

Postby wkitty42 » Sun Oct 16, 2022 10:43 pm

PH-RVL wrote in Sun Oct 16, 2022 7:16 pm:Intel or AMD?

i use AMD... specifically a Ryzen 7 8-core 4Ghz... i've used AMD ever since intel sued AMD decades ago over the 486 (i think it was)...
"You get more air close to the ground," said Angalo. "I read that in a book. You get lots of air low down, and not much when you go up."
"Why not?" said Gurder.
"Dunno. It's frightened of heights, I guess."
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Re: New desktop PC

Postby MariuszXC » Tue Oct 18, 2022 2:23 pm

V12 wrote in Sun Oct 16, 2022 9:14 pm:
MariuszXC wrote in Thu Sep 29, 2022 9:00 am:I 16GB will be plenty for most tasks

Bad idea for FG. [...]

Not quite fair argument, you forgot to quote the rest of my sentence, which recommended keeping some memory slots available for future expansion.
Anyway, if you go for max settings you need max memory, it is your choice. Looking at the image you posted I am not sure I see many details in the distant haze though, so *I* do not see any appreciable benefit from 270km LOD and use more conservative setting. Just my personal choice.

One more thing. If you look a the original question, OP seems to be considering his budget rather carefully.

@PH-RVL
Intel or AMD?

Go with whatever you are comfortable with and can get a good MB for, plus cooling etc.
The way things are in FG at the moment, value more a single core performance rather than a number of cores.
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Re: New desktop PC

Postby V12 » Tue Oct 18, 2022 5:39 pm

With 250 km visibility limit I see big benefit - the scenery looks much more realistic than with only 100 km visibility limit. Price difference between 16 and 32 GB is marginal, much less than between low cost used GTX750 and GTX1060 6GB or something better. FG is not optimized, so I prefer RAM over VRAM. I never had VRAM problems with only 2 GB GTX750 even on maximum settings.
And if You can, avoid AMD GPUs (compatibility issues) and CPUs (low singlecore performance).
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