HHS wrote in Wed Jun 09, 2021 10:19 pm:Which sounds btw. funny, because the method is simple by creating your own repo or fork the original repo and ask for merge.
StuartC wrote in Wed Jun 09, 2021 9:47 pm:[..] although it's not fed back that's only because we don't have the method to commit them to the required repositories
There might be a barrier here with regards to technology / operating system / preffered (G)UI input.
HHS wrote in Wed Jun 09, 2021 10:19 pm:It is the same behavior we have seen with FGMembers. It can harm the original project- that's why it is called 'hostile'.
I don't think there is any hostile motivation from either side - e.g. FGUK aren't a side of whatever historical(?) drama happened in the past with FGMembers. FGUK don't have an alternative vision in some part for FG that they are trying to push (?) even through unrelated areas like development and giving back changes (?). From what I've seen, FGUK have been friendly towards the main Flightgear project, doing their part to inform people and clear misconceptions [
1] without bringing a conflict into it etc. StuartC also announces releases on the forum.
FGUK have download counters in their hangar so they're aware [
2] that unless something is in the launcher almost no one sees it, given how few browse the forum. There would be a much larger heli community by now if compatible work had been added to the launcher - even without non-GPL textures etc, including a lot more heli flyers from the UK in their multiplayer group.
I don't think StuartC (a windows person) uses git/svn in his workflow somehow - or is comfortable with technical things like mailing lists (which also seem to be a bit tricky to use with web based mail clients from my experience so far).
From my pretty anecdotal observations of the parts of the (development parts of) forums I've read, the forum seems to be almost all Linux users or MacOS (which is also POSIX based underneath) users according to what OS info is present in posts. A lot of the Linux / Mac FG contributors seem to be either familiar with scripting or programming of some sort and have a lot of surrounding knowledge or commandline skills that can be taken for granted - even if they are from non-programming backgrounds professionally. So there seems to be an entry barrier related to OS background. The thing with such barriers is affected people aren't visible at all - but you can sometimes spot the missing part when the expected number of doesn't match e.g. there's a lot of downloads from Windows users, and other sims like FSX do have a huge modding community despite being Windows. Occasionally Windows people do come from FSX e.g. this experienced scenery modder who found FG on flightsim.com forums but had couldn't figure out [
3] how to start porting his work despite putting in a lot of effort and even buying a flash drive.
FGUK probably(?) makes it easier for Windows people to participate by exchanging zip files etc.
What FGUK work has been added to FGAddon seems to be when existing FGAddon people like Richard (Jaguar GR1) or Helijah (DA 40) taking zip files and integrating it.
I think the amount of Windows users may have improved slightly in the last year or two (certainly FG first impressions and UI has improved which should help people get into FG). But it was only a short while ago there wasn't really any Windows people in the mailinglist [
link], and Legoboyvdlp picked up Windows build tweaking for a while as James is mainly on Mac (there are a few people these days). When I first found FG, IIRC only a couple of forum regulars seemed to use Windows - Richard, Legoboyvdlp, neocolatis, StuartC, octal (also on Mac), and a couple of other people I might be forgetting.
(Me being on the forums isn't really indicative of a lower entry barrier for Windows people either - as I'm an outlier - e.g. while I'm not a programmer professionally, I at least knew something of C/C++ before finding FG, enough to follow GLSL).
I'm not sure what percentage of people in FGUK use git/svn, if any - or use Windows - but it's probably different from the forum.
Google suggests there are good GUI clients for SVN it seems, including simple ones that just integrate into windows explorer - but haven't tested (currently trying git extensions with FGData git on the theory the client may be fast/responsive compared to others as it's done in C++). For new aircraft developers it probably needs a video demonstration or something to setup and use FGAddon for the few common operations needed for most use.
HHS wrote in Fri Jun 11, 2021 7:04 am:And those are all on the mailing-list -like me- the official place where FlightGear is coordinated.
It's unfortunate as in the normal course of things, StuartC and other long time FGUK developers would have a lot of input or regression reports to provide on the mailing list - Given aircraft devs are really well placed to notice issues and provide feedback. In addition they'd probably be senior FGAddon reviewers and mentors by now etc.
Kind regards