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Minimum and recommended computer spec?

Postby jackhulk » Wed Aug 26, 2020 8:03 pm

Hello

Is there an up to date minimum and recommended computer spec for the latest FlightGear please?

The only specs I can find is on the wiki http://wiki.flightgear.org/Hardware_recommendations# but that refers to extremely old version (3.2)

Thank you
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Re: Minimum and recommended computer spec?

Postby jackhulk » Wed Dec 09, 2020 12:43 pm

Anyone please?
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Re: Minimum and recommended computer spec?  

Postby Hooray » Wed Dec 09, 2020 12:57 pm

Unfortunately, updating such wiki pages isn't exaxctly our strongest forte here - just a couple of days ago, people were sharing their specs in another topic and I suggested to update that wiki article.

Either way, roughly speaking you'll probably want at least:
- a dedicated GPU with an NVIDIA/ATI chipset with at least 1024MB of VRAM, preferably not much older than say 18-24 months (but also not much newer than 6 months, because graphics card are becoming better and cheaper as we speak)
- at least 6-8gb of free RAM (I would opt for 16b)
- a quad-core CPU
- 50-100gb of free disk space

If you can afford it, I'd suggest to "double"these specs (2gb of VRAM, 16-32gb of RAM, 8+ core CPU, 128-256gb SSD drive)

In general, a corresponding system can be had for roughly $250-$500 US these days, depending on your part of the world - if you're able/willing to use a refurbished server, things can become much cheaper, and you'll primarily need to add a decent graphics card into the mix. A notebook will obviously be more mobile, more integrated, less powerful and more expensive.
Last edited by Hooray on Wed Dec 09, 2020 1:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Minimum and recommended computer spec?

Postby CaptB » Wed Dec 09, 2020 1:06 pm

Posting your current or planned specs could make it easier for us to comment on.
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Re: Minimum and recommended computer spec?

Postby Hooray » Wed Dec 09, 2020 1:16 pm

Another option is getting a used CAD workstation: CAD workstations often come with dedicated NVIDIA graphics card, while those are not optimized for "3D gaming", they often provide plenty of bang for the buck - depending on where you live, you can check out craiglist, ebay etc - and a workstation with 32-128gb of RAM, SSD drives and dedicated nvidia graphics will often be in the $500 US range. And even if you're not satisfied with the CAD GPU, you can easily drop in another graphics card for roughly $100-150 US.

To see for yourself, look for a "HP Z800 workstation" - at the very least these will typically come with 32 gb of RAM, there are cheaper/less powerful variants available, too:
HP Z600
HP Z420

These days, CAD graphics card typically come with 12+ gb of VRAM

https://greenpcgamers.forumbee.com/t/36 ... puter-blog
back in 2019 someone wrote: Using the criteria above you can build a good to borderline high end gaming system using a HP Z800 Workstation.

Sample Configuration:

HP Z800 Workstation

1 x 6C Xeon X5690 3.46Ghz 12MB 6.40GTs

32GB PC10600R (4 x 8GB)

Samsung 256GB 6GBPS SSD + Samsung Evo 970 NVME.2 SSD

GTX1080 w/8GB Graphics Card

1 x 10/100/1000 Network Port

1100W Power Supply

DVD-RW

10 Pro 64Bit



We have tested this system with games like Dota 2, CS Go, PubG, and The Division. The frames can range from 60FPS to 200FPS depending on the game and settings that you choose. The system was tested using a 144Hz 27" Acer Monitor.


Again, FlightGear isn't optimized for such GPUs, and such GPUs are not optimized for 3D simulation, and shader units - if in doubt, read up on how gaming GPUs differ compared to CAD GPUs

Speaking in general, a Z800 with 64 gb of RAM and 12gb of VRAM does offer quite a bit of horsepower, for only 300 bucks (or even less)
A dedicated gaming GPU is typically 100-150 USD these days, even though I am still not suggesting to currently buy one: https://www.tomshardware.com/news/terri ... -late-2020

https://www.graitec.co.uk/hardware/cad- ... g-graphics
https://graphicscardhub.com/workstation ... hics-card/

Given how FlightGear is being developed and designed, I would not expect to spend more than 300-400 USD on hardware currently (hardware that will be good enough for the next 3-5 years probably) - FlightGear is facing some very real architectural issues, and even with the changes currently in the pipeline (compositor, compositeviewer, WS 3.0 scenery/LOD and ortho scenery), you're unlikely to benefit from purchasing top-notch hardware currently - it's best to keep your budget in the low hundreds (200-350) and then incrementally update a solid platform like the Z800 (e.g. by adding a better graphics card over the course of the next 12-18 months).

Right now, I don't quite see how purchasing a high-end system makes sense.
FlightGear really isn't very optimized, and it's not very good at leveraging dedicated gaming systems - and FlightGear is lacking built-in tools to gather performance stats, i.e. to track what's going on at the subsystems level, and at the sub-subsystem level (think Nasal GC; property I/O, swapping, RAM/VRAM utilization etc).

So, if you limit your budget to ~300-350 USD, you can still set aside 10 USD/month to have the option to upgrade your graphics card (or RAM/CPU!) every 18 months or so, without having to change the whole system. My assertion is, it will take more than 5+ years for FlightGear to fully leverage a system like the Z800. Thus, 400-500 USD/5 years is something like 100 USD/year or 9 USD/month, or 0.30 USD/day :D
Please don't send support requests by PM, instead post your questions on the forum so that all users can contribute and benefit
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Re: Minimum and recommended computer spec?

Postby tom_nl » Wed Dec 09, 2020 5:13 pm

In my (limited) experience FG seems pretty happy on older hardware. For reference, i'm running FG 2020.3 on a 6½ year old MacBook Pro with 2.5GHz quad core i7, 16GB ram, 2GB Geforce 750M which is driving 2x 1920x1200 and 1x 1920x1080 screens (this is officially not supported by the hardware, but works fine, and more importantly looks great :D ). I have some graphics options turned down, but it looks nice enough to me and i'm getting a consistent (deliberately rate limited) 25FPS with the Cessna over simpler scenery (easy to find when flying over Holland because it's flat!), which drops down to 15-ish FPS over more complex areas like Amsterdam.

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Re: Minimum and recommended computer spec?

Postby Hooray » Wed Dec 09, 2020 5:26 pm

a quad core system, with 16gb of RAM and dedicated graphics with 2gb of VRAM still is a fairly decent system these days, even as a mobile device.
Still, it's probably what I'd consider the "minimum" these days for people wanting to set up a system specifically for FlightGear.
Obviously, FlightGear isn't "Crysis" - but anything much lower than these specs, might be frustrating by future developments.

However, like I said, I would be very surprised if over the course of the next 36-60 months, FlightGear would address all its technical/architectural challenges that are currently preventing it from leveraging modern gaming rigs.

FlightGear simply isn't there yet - and even if the core team were able to address core most issues, there simply is too much fgdata stuff (Nasal !!) that cannot easily be ignored - even the way people currently tend to use Nasal + Canvas is highly problematic from a rendering standpoint, if you want fast rendering, it simply is not a good idea to set up subsystems or avionics in Nasal space using timers and listeners, which then update properties to in turn update a FBO/RTT context to update a MFD ... this kind of thing is prohibitive when it comes to modern OpenGL/OSG, let alone anything involving Vulkan and multi-threading.

Which is to say, an 8-core system (2-3 ghz), 16+ gb of RAM, 2gb of VRAM is certainly going to suffice for quite a while... and using a workstation like the Z800 will provide plenty of buffer to grow over time - Compared to X-Plane or MSFS FlightGear simply isn't there yet, so there really isn't much to be gained from buying the latest gaming rigs, unless you happen to be into turning on all the latest eye candy (effects and shaders), or if you're a contributor/developer.
Please don't send support requests by PM, instead post your questions on the forum so that all users can contribute and benefit
Thanks & all the best,
Hooray
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pui2canvas | MapStructure | Canvas Development | Programming resources
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