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Junkers F13 (Update: ALPHA released by helijah!!!)

Questions and discussion about creating aircraft. Flight dynamics, 3d models, cockpits, systems, animation, textures.

Re: Junkers F13 (request FDM & Skin)

Postby pauljs75 » Tue Nov 04, 2008 10:06 pm

Any info on the prop? I'm going to do a separate mini-tut just for that part. (Because the method behind making it is useful for all propeller aircraft.) If I had some specs that particular part, I could model close to them. Otherwise I'm going to guess-timate from what little there is of the propeller on the 3-view drawings. Basically I need the thickness (at the hub), hub diameter, blade diameter, blade root pitch angle, and blade tip pitch angle. I doubt I could get it perfect (at least in a reasonable timeframe), but should be able to get close with those numbers alone.

Also I swore I saw some version with 4 doors in a pic or two (I hope I wasn't imagining that, since I modeled it that way), but a lot of the drawings and other pics only show two doors. I'm not going to redo the tutorial just for that (it's already work enough to explain things and edit pics, etc.) but I can fix that in the model if it's an error on my part or a somewhat rare modification.

And last but not least, the corrugated patterns in the skin are going to be part of a texture map. (Not sure if FG supports bump or displacement in its renderer, but it can be approximated in the coloring alone. In other words "faking it". I'll probably go over it in a texturing overview, but that has to wait until the UV mapping section is done.) Trying to do that kind of detail in an actual mesh would be a "poly-bomb" and counter-productive to rendering otherwise. (I know it's quite true just for slowing down "artistic" rendering, let alone a sim where its suppose to render in real-time.)
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Re: Junkers F13 (request FDM & Skin)

Postby DFaber » Wed Nov 05, 2008 6:58 am

pauljs75 wrote:And last but not least, the corrugated patterns in the skin are going to be part of a texture map. (Not sure if FG supports bump or displacement in its renderer, but it can be approximated in the coloring alone. In other words "faking it". I'll probably go over it in a texturing overview, but that has to wait until the UV mapping section is done.) Trying to do that kind of detail in an actual mesh would be a "poly-bomb" and counter-productive to rendering otherwise. (I know it's quite true just for slowing down "artistic" rendering, let alone a sim where its suppose to render in real-time.)


I've made this effect for the ju52. In Gimp it is a reapeating color gradient bump mapped onto the color layer. Required a fair amount of tuning, but the result was quite good. I'm tempted to volunteer doing it, but I'm overwhelmed with projects these days (working on the F4U1, jeep, walker,ships,...), so it may take some time.

Greetings
Detlef Faber
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Re: Junkers F13 (request FDM & Skin)

Postby pauljs75 » Thu Nov 06, 2008 7:16 pm

I couldn't find much specific on the propeller from the available information, so I eyeballed the dimensions from one of the plans and rounded it to the nearest "metric" values. The modeling of the propeller mesh is now complete in it's own mini-tutorial. So if you want to learn how it's modeled you can check out this link:

http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Wings_3D/T ... _Propeller

Also the main aircraft tutorial links to that as well, so it's covered even if folks don't look at this particular thread.

I'll get around to UV'ing the propeller next before doing another step or two on the Junkers F13 itself. Then it's getting into the task of UV'ing the main aircraft.

-----Edit-----

Propeller UV mapping is now done. Check out the propeller tutorial to learn the process.
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Re: Junkers F13 (request FDM & Skin)

Postby saturn5 » Fri Nov 14, 2008 3:18 pm

pauljs75 wrote:Any info on the prop? I'm going to do a separate mini-tut just for that part. (Because the method behind making it is useful for all propeller aircraft.) If I had some specs that particular part, I could model close to them. Otherwise I'm going to guess-timate from what little there is of the propeller on the 3-view drawings. Basically I need the thickness (at the hub), hub diameter, blade diameter, blade root pitch angle, and blade tip pitch angle. I doubt I could get it perfect (at least in a reasonable timeframe), but should be able to get close with those numbers alone.

Also I swore I saw some version with 4 doors in a pic or two (I hope I wasn't imagining that, since I modeled it that way), but a lot of the drawings and other pics only show two doors. I'm not going to redo the tutorial just for that (it's already work enough to explain things and edit pics, etc.) but I can fix that in the model if it's an error on my part or a somewhat rare modification.

And last but not least, the corrugated patterns in the skin are going to be part of a texture map. (Not sure if FG supports bump or displacement in its renderer, but it can be approximated in the coloring alone. In other words "faking it". I'll probably go over it in a texturing overview, but that has to wait until the UV mapping section is done.) Trying to do that kind of detail in an actual mesh would be a "poly-bomb" and counter-productive to rendering otherwise. (I know it's quite true just for slowing down "artistic" rendering, let alone a sim where its suppose to render in real-time.)


I could not find anything specific on that prop, just the close-ups in some of the photo galleries. It looks like the propeller tutorial came out great anyway though! Also, I could not find any versions with 4 doors, or at least the version off which those blueprints are based but some artistic and historic license is required anyway. The model and tutorial look really great!
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Re: Junkers F13 (request FDM & Skin)

Postby pauljs75 » Thu Dec 25, 2008 12:38 am

Took a bit of a hiatus in working on it, but am starting up again bit by bit. Added some external hardware and undercarriage. Once I get the seats and a few more bits on, I'll probably update the tutorial to show that. Then it's on to UV mapping the exterior and adding that info to the tutorial.

Image

Hope it wasn't too long a break.
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Re: Junkers F13 (request FDM & Skin)

Postby saturn5 » Wed Dec 09, 2009 1:11 pm

Hi, I was wondering how things went with this project and what we need to finish it. If it is on hold and there is enough interest maybe there is someone who can help pauljs after he has done so much already.

2009 is the 90th anniversary of its first flight and of the start of the very first commercial airlines in 1919-1921 with with which it served. (e.g. Mercury Aviation, Dutch KLM, Luft Hansa etc.) One exciting thing about it, is the many unique early airline liveries it experienced.

In August of 1920, Mercury Aviation bought its first factory new plane (JL-6) from Junkers, and it was delivered by famed WWI ace, Eddie Rickenbacker to DeMille Field #2. In May 1921 that plane flew its first scheduled flight for Mercury from L.A. to San Diego.


http://www.scripophily.net/merexcor.html
http://www.eads.net/1024/en/eads/history/airhist/1910_1919/junkers_f13_1919.html
http://books.google.com/books?id=Tt7g_WEvE20C&pg=PA28&lpg=PA28&dq=junker+j+13&source=bl&ots=4wzAzgGqBW&sig=_vRj7iGP4R7fUw82gT9f6snYc9A&hl=en&ei=Z74rS_KSGcnNlAeI7_CbBw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=4&ved=0CBoQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q=&f=false

Image
http://www.aerofiles.com/_j.html
Image

Image
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Re: Junkers F13 (request FDM & Skin)

Postby saturn5 » Fri Dec 31, 2010 5:34 pm

Hello, does anyone know the status of this project?
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Re: Junkers F13 (request FDM & Skin)

Postby EigerSA » Sun Sep 25, 2011 12:32 pm

Hi there. I'm a huge fan of early aviation and was planning on starting an aircraft build project of the F13 before I came across this thread. Anyone know the status of this project?
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Re: Junkers F13 (request FDM & Skin)

Postby saturn5 » Tue Feb 07, 2012 8:13 pm

Hello EigerSA, it was lucky that someone started this project but they have not been heard from since. They left these tutorials:

http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Wings_3D/T ... unkers_F13
http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Wings_3D/T ... _Propeller
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Re: Junkers F13 (request FDM & Skin)

Postby helijah » Tue Feb 07, 2012 8:30 pm

Hi all,

Aahh Here is a airplane that was in my todo list, prominently. I'll be able to remove it :) One less to do

Regards. Emmanuel
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http://embaranger.free.fr
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Re: Junkers F13 (request FDM & Skin)

Postby JC_SV » Tue Feb 07, 2012 9:49 pm

helijah wrote in Tue Feb 07, 2012 8:30 pm:Hi all,

Aahh Here is a airplane that was in my todo list, prominently. I'll be able to remove it :) One less to do

Regards. Emmanuel

I hope you are kidding. Pauljs75 didn't finished it and his last post dates from Dec 2008.
You better don't remove it from your TODO list ( just in case you were not kidding ...) jeje

Cheers.
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Re: Junkers F13 (request FDM & Skin)

Postby helijah » Fri Feb 10, 2012 12:29 am

Ah! OK ok I bow to the mob lol

Regards Emmanuel
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Re: Junkers F13 (request FDM & Skin)

Postby helijah » Sat Feb 18, 2012 10:21 am

JC_SV wrote in Tue Feb 07, 2012 9:49 pm:I hope you are kidding. Pauljs75 didn't finished it and his last post dates from Dec 2008.
You better don't remove it from your TODO list ( just in case you were not kidding ...) jeje

Cheers.


Hey JC_SV,

If I show it, do you think I will still make me boo? lol
Image

Regards. Emmanuel
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Re: Junkers F13 (request FDM & Skin)

Postby JC_SV » Sat Feb 18, 2012 3:27 pm

Nice ! Saturn5 and EigerSA will be happy to see you are working on it! And I am too. Early airplanes are always exciting. And this one has been long waited !

Regards. JC_SV
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Re: Junkers F13 (request FDM & Skin)

Postby saturn5 » Sat Feb 18, 2012 5:12 pm

Yes, this is such exciting news and a cause for celebration!!! Thank God!!!
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